CMAS or PADI?

[maxwolfie]

Hi, there's been a few deals lately on websites such as Groupon/Scoopon that are offering diving ceritications equivalent to CMAS 1 Star / PADI Advanced Open Water for approx $150. The latest one is a CMAS certification and I was just wondering what is best for a casual Sydney diver? Are there any limitations or negatives with going with a CMAS certification, particularly if wanting to dive overseas?

 

[Aquapro Dive Services]

Opening up a hornets nest here! This debate wil go on for ever, but a an original BSAC diver who also ended up as BSAC, CMAS and PADI instructor I cantell you that it is the instructor that makes a good course. the certification agency just provide the tools.

PADI is the market leader and therefore the most recognised. If you even lose your card your details can be easily retrieved and checked. So if casual and you want to dive every now and then it may be a good option to have this back up.

You dont have to do a ful Open water course with PADI. can do a Scuba Diver coruse which is first 2 trainig dives and enables you to dive down to 12m with a dive master of instructor wihtout having to go through the whole intro dive process.

But short answer to your question CMAS 1 star is not an equivalent to PADI Advanced. Its the equivelane to Open Water OR Scuba Diver depending on how its taught. You nee to check how many training dives are included (need 4 for it to be equivalent to O/W and need to dive to around 18m max).

Advanced is 5 dives on top of the initial 4 O/W training dives. too much to go onto here and there is a separate forum for this that you may be better off posting or looking on.

Generally when someone brings a CMAS cetification card on board the boats we always ask to look at the log book. That clarifies experience. So check out how many dives you get, and whether it allows you to dive independantly or always with a dive pro. Remember you get what you pay for in this game and $150 sounds awfully cheap.

Personally to avoid any confusion when travelling i would go PADI.

 

[DevonDiver]

 

[bracko]

another way is to call the dive store you are most likely to dive with after you are certified (or hire gear from) and ask them whether they recognise the CMAS certification.

they may try and woffle on as to why *insert their certifying agency here* is better, but you need to get out of them whether they will give you gear or let you on the boat with a CMAS card.

once you have 20 or so dives it's a non event as Aqua pro mentioned, you will have a dive log history and the shop/boat's DM will work out if you're fibbing in 20sec flat.

however, do PADI and there are no problems.

 

[Thalassamania]

Andy, I do not know who put those tables together but there are some serious absurdities that make me question the entire can of worms, for example:

• a CMAS three star usually ranks with a BSAC Advanced Diver, while a PADI DM is usually a BSAC Dive Leader or CMAS two star, leveling a CMAS three star with a PADI DM is absurd.
• a NAUI Master Diver is way more qualified than a PADI Rescue Diver, in fact should equilibrate somewhere between a PADI IDC Candidate and a PADI Scuba Instructor.
• a NAUI DM is above a NAUI AI, and way above a PADI DM.
• a PADI IDC candidate should not be at the level of a CMAS two star instructor.

I'm sure you got them some place "official" which just points to the absurdity and political nature of the entire exercise.

 

[DevonDiver]

Hi Thal,

The tables show how different agencies rank equivalency levels (for cross-over), they're not generic. There's skew in that, because some agencies don't have direct equivalents - thus draw a line at the most relevant level to their syllabus. I tried to show the differences, by illustrating both the CMAS and PADI tables, along with the ISO table that is more generic in attributing 'levels'.

(probably should have explained that when I posted the tables, but was rushing out the door at the time of posting).

 

[Thalassamania]

So those rankings are your opinion, your best word match, what?

 

[DevonDiver]

What I could find online, as a resource/guide.

 

[Thalassamania]

I wish there was something "official" the things I find on line vary widely, e.g., compare to: Equivalent Diving Qualifications from Different Bodies

I would note that I found one table you displayed on a site that touts itself: Professional PADI Instructors from every region, and another on a "science volunteer" site that will let you pay some £1,700 for a three week vacation while you train as a PADI open water diver and pretend to be an underwater scientist.

 

[Damselfish]

Whatever the accuracy of all those tables, they are probably confusing the OP more than answering the original question.

Most people will say out of the major agencies it doesn't matter a great deal which one you start with, as at the recreational level you can take any future classes with different agencies, and the instructor matters more. But the agencies do have differences in the ways they operate and what they cover in what certification, and CMAS is definitely a different beast than PADI, so it wouldn't hurt to understand all that. As far as international recognition, a certification from any major agency should be recognized anyplace. Anyplace you are likely to travel to dive, it's unlikely you will ever have trouble with a PADI card (unless maybe you want to dive in France?) I do think you may find the occasional shop in some place that is clueless about CMAS, but I don't know how likely this is to be an actual problem nowadays.


From the point of view of a business, the idea of offering a Groupon type deal is the hope of getting new customers and bringing in future business, since it's unlikely they're making much of anything between the deal and Groupon's cut. Lots of places don't really make money on their OW classes even at their regular price, they make it by selling gear. And it's somewhat common for scuba classes (even outside of any "deals") to quote a price that doesn't include everything, there could be extra charges for books, required gear purchases, gear rentals, OW dives, paperwork, all sorts of things. Perhaps if you post a pointer to the details of the specific deal/shop/class you are looking at people can comment on how it looks.

So if you want to learn to dive I'd look for a good place/instructor to get certified. If you can get a good deal that's great, but deals aren't always as good as they appear. And keep in mind that while there's lots of good ways to economize, scuba is not one of your cheaper activities.