how much do shops make on us???

[Phreak]

LDS are closing here in the Seattle area. I'm surprised some of these guys lasted as long as they did, and I still think one or two more will fold. All the shops here are feeling the effects of the economy.

I went into a LDS about a month - it was dark, cramped with too much gear, (used old wetsuits by the mile)and there was one guy working. The location was really crummy - on an arterial street, and the building gets hit with graffiti once a week it seems.

And they are still open? It's strange.

The good news might be - that because all our dive shops have the Ocean 5 miles away ( or less) there is plenty of diving going on. There are a lot of tanks to get filled.

I cant imagine owning a dive shop in landlocked Montana.

 

[redacted]

As usual, we have the "scuba professionals" rallying around the support your local dive shop flag. I do understand that as that is where your activity is based and supported.
But your responses are tainted by the obvious bias.

Shop around. Find the deal that is best for you.

 

[widget]

I am not quite sure its fair to compare profits derived from a food vendor and profits derived from a scuba vendor. Although the principle is the same, the reality is worlds apart, simply because we all have to eat - usually on a daily basis none of us have to buy scuba equipment. There is also a huge differance in price, a coupla bucks for a burger and a softdrink (most folk can afford this, budget daily for it and think no more about it) but a good few hundred for a scuba regulator which may only get used 10 times a year alone - few folk drive down the road and spontaniously think "i'll just stop in there and drop $500. on a reg, octo and gauge set up,these really are "planned" purchase's, hense a price comparison issue.

But, be that as it may, I think one of the biggest problems still is that there are simply not enough divers to support the industry which has spawned around it, everybody is chasing a diminishing slice of the divers available spend, right from the gear manufacturers, to the distributors, to the retailers, to the training agencies, to the compressor manufacturers, to the local dive venues, to the vacation venues, to the hotels, to the auxillary suppliers of products like cameras, accessories, clothing......and, and, and - its gotton beyond "tight" - theres just nothing left anymore.

 

[CamG]

Greetings fellow divers and to the OP. I can honestly say that LDS do mark up gear but some not as much as others there are manufactures minimum prices that they have to abide by as well.
Jim has really given the information you requested and key man pricing for dive professionals does rock! But bear in mind it also is the best type of advertisement there is. So gear man. have realized this and it is in their best interest to put dive trainers is their gear. What do think new OW students are going to buy? What the Instructor or DM is wearing.
I work in the furniture retail world and I can say that the mark up in that industry is staggering in comparison. It is not uncommon to find 150% or more on some products.
RIDICULOUS!
So do not attach your local dive shop to harshly they are trying to survive in one of the toughest economies in recent history. I know there are some out there who would disagree but I have the opportunity to work with two LDS's both have to make money to survive but are very competitive with on-line retailers. So you tell me how they do it? Not by gouging the day lights out of customers but they do have overhead costs as well as try to provide for their families.
I have paid to much for things at times but come out far ahead in the end when service was extended. Always remember that they are just like you and want to make a living and provide good service. If they are not running in good faith then move on and find another. Simple.
CamG Keep diving....keep training....keep learning!

 

[oly5050user]

$50 per hour!!! I'd bet that is only those with a GED.

I was talking about $50 per student for the entire course.

So you think an independent instructor with all the overhead that goes with it should make $50. on a private student that it takes him 18 to 20 hours to train?
What world do you live on? Get realistic.What kind of money are you willing to work for? I am sure it is more than the $2.50 an hour you want the instructor to work for after delivering 20 hrs of training for $50.
At $50. per hour it still is not much to walk away with after expenses of teaching 1 or 2 private students.If teaching at a LDS then the LDS is assuming costs associated with bringing in and training someone.The instructor then gets much less $ per hour. But is kept more busy with more students supplied by the facility.

 

[SkimFisher]

The dry snorkel you paid 49 bucks for may have cost the shop 12-15 dollars or even less if they bought in quantity or took advantage of a deal at DEMA.

Who pays $49 for a dry snorkel? I would laugh the whole way back to my car.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Maybe some dive shop do need to be rinsed out?
I think during good times almost anybody can make it to some degree, but then when things go bad the ones lacking in customer service or the ones with bad attitudes will be the first to go. This will shift remaining business over to the stronger shops. The shops with the best customer service, friendliest service, and best prices will win. It's simple.

Monterey used to have 5 dive shops that were all kind of trudging along. The economy pruned out 2 of them and as a result the remaining three are reasonably healthy.

 

[boulderjohn]

Honestly, I think the pro LDS is fast becoming a dinosaur, just before Dema last year I was visiting a manufacturer in Europe and they were saying pro LDS shops there simply can no longer survive selling only dive equipment and courses, so to keep in business they "morph" into combination "fishing / canoeing / camping / diving" operations, ....

I was thinking along those lines myself. I was envisioning a scenario in which large sporting goods stores started selling dive gear. I see a lot that scares me in sucha scenario, but I have to admit I also see a lot of potential for good.

I am about to make a far-fetched analogy, but maybe it will work.

Here in Colorado we have a number of laws regarding alcoholic beverages that are frankly designed to protect the liquor stores. We do not allow liquor store chains, and grocery stores can only sell low alcohol beer.

When I visit other states that allow wine and liquor to be sold in grocery stores, I am struck by the difference.

• While we do have quite a few liquor stores clerked by someone who would not know the difference between Margaux and Ripple, the ones I visit have real experts on staff who can give great advice on a wide variety of choices, in wine, beer, and liquor. If those of you living in whatever country you are in right now have a favorite beer, there is an excellent chance I can pick some up this afternoon. When my son was married a couple of years ago, the father of the bride had a sudden, last minute inspiration and walked across the street to the liquor store there and picked up a 30 year old single malt scotch.
• In the grocery stores I visit in other states, the selection is pretty standard stuff, and there is no one around who knows anything about any of the choices. I have never seen something like Einbecker Urbock (one of my favorite beers) sold in one of them, and the choice 30 year old single malts is decidedly thin.
• Surprisingly enough, the prices are generally cheaper in our dedicated liquor stores. You would think it would be the opposite.

I wonder if the same sort of thing is the future of scuba shops.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Who pays $49 for a dry snorkel? I would laugh the whole way back to my car.

You'd be surprised at just who does it. Ever price an Aqualung Impulse at an Aqualung dealer. I saw a whole SWAT team with them a few years ago at the local training lake. They got a grant from HS to train to sweep the rivers for bombs in advance of the MLB allstar game. They all had new Impulse snorkels, some had split fins, and they all had new DUI drysuits which some had never even been in before their OW checkouts! Seriously. They told me and another instructor so. Oh and they even had a new seadoo scooter. All I could think was if there was another terrorist attack that would be the time to do it. Those guys were bad and it was not their fault. they got sold a bunch of useless stuff and it happened because they and Homeland Security did not know any better. And I just checked scubatoys and leisurepro have dry snorkels for 45 and even 65 for an atomic.

 

[rigdiver]

So you think an independent instructor with all the overhead that goes with it should make $50. on a private student that it takes him 18 to 20 hours to train?
What world do you live on? Get realistic.What kind of money are you willing to work for? I am sure it is more than the $2.50 an hour you want the instructor to work for after delivering 20 hrs of training for $50.
At $50. per hour it still is not much to walk away with after expenses of teaching 1 or 2 private students.If teaching at a LDS then the LDS is assuming costs associated with bringing in and training someone.The instructor then gets much less $. But is kept more busy with more students supplied by the facility.

It costs me about $800 per year just to say I'm a SCUBA Instructor. By AWAP math that is 16 students just to break even. Wake up and smell the coffee!!!