Manufacturer condones Warsaw Grouper slaughter

[ReefGuy]

Ironically, here in Florida (where the picture was taken), Ms, and LA a lot more than letter writting is going on. The recreational fishermen here (not just spearos, but H&L as well) are in legal battles to outlaw these wasteful fishing practices in an effort to establish and maintain a sustainable fishery. This fight is being led by, among others, the Fishing Rights Alliance (www.thefra.org). I also believe that Zeigle has been well represented in this fight, but I'll let Scott speak for himself.

It's ironic because many of those who are on the forefront of this battle, who are unwilling to allow the rape of the Gulf of Mexico, are the very ones being attacked in this thread. Their actions speak much louder than words spoken on an anonymous web site.

Go ahead. People outside the SE Asias should put more pressure on the illegal fishing that goes on around here. Start a thread, post pics of blast fishing, etc. then maybe we can all begin writing letters to the local governments around here to begin investing more in their coastal security (and don't forget to include a paragraph on the benefits of spearfishing!).

There's a saying here: a marine protected area is only established with a rifle.


edit: actually, maybe write letters to the local newspapers. That may be more effective.

 

[archman]

Referring back to much earlier posts...

I'm still bothered that a commercial fisherman used his license for recreational purposes, with other recreational users. Actually I only am irritated with the latter aspect, as it brings up a potential precedent for "friends" to effectively "charter" commercial boats out in a recreational role. It seems that Dan's crew were all his uh, crew, which isn't so bad, but it could very well have been a bunch of pal divers merely taking advantage of one dude's commercial license.

Fortunately Dan keeps up with NOAA press releases, and got his boat out just before they released this.

Commercial Fishery for Deep-Water Grouper Closes June 23
June 17, 2005
Release from:
NOAA
NOAA Fisheries Service has closed the commercial fishery for deep-water grouper (including misty grouper, snowy grouper, yellowedge grouper, warsaw grouper, and speckled hind) in the exclusive economic zone (EEZ) of the Gulf of Mexico. This closure is necessary to protect the deep-water grouper resource.

Based on current statistics, NOAA Fisheries Service has determined that the commercial quota will be reached on or before June 22, 2005. Accordingly, the commercial deep-water grouper fishery in the Gulf of Mexico EEZ will be closed from June 23, 2005, until January 1, 2006. During the closure, bag and possession limits apply to all harvest or possession of deep-water grouper in or from the Gulf of Mexico EEZ, and the sale or purchase of deep-water grouper taken from the EEZ is prohibited. The prohibition does not apply to sale or purchase of deep-water grouper that were landed and sold prior to June 23, 2005, and held in cold storage by a dealer or processor.

http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/fish/InNews/fishnews0262005.htm

I do not like the idea of a bunch of yahoo's reading the zeagle and spearboard posts about this and getting it into their heads that they can bribe or otherwise get a commercial operator to take them on what is essentially a recreational charter. I know some spearers and rod/reel fishers in Florida and Texas that would very much attempt this, if it could snag them some big fish. There's plenty of shallow water dive spots in federal waters where less qualified groups could go.

 

[Kim]

At the end of the day local policies are going to determine what happens to fish stocks. In places where they are environmentally managed properly they will still be fishing in the future. Other places.........
Sometimes what's necessary to protect resources is dramatic. A quick look at what is happening in the North Sea shows that clearly - many boats give up completely and whole communities lose their traditional livelihood. Other paces the boats stop not because of regulations - but because there are simply no fish left.
As the FSU document reported that Rick posted the Warsaw grouper is very close to being included on the protected/endangered list. The males seem to need protection from the fisheries as they stay in one place. As it's so deep it's not accessable to many divers so it's hard to see that spearfishing will constitute such a threat to them. They do constitute a finite resource though that if not managed well could easily go the same way as other resources and stocks that used to exist - but no longer do.

 

[JustinW]

why is this thread not locked and deleted already?

 

[Kim]

why is this thread not locked and deleted already?

Why? It's a contentious topic to be sure but as long as people can remain civil and discuss the issues it's a valid one. As NetDoc said earlier - if anyone believes that any posts cross the line they should report the posts using the report button.

 

[Wayward Son]

Referring back to much earlier posts...

I'm still bothered that a commercial fisherman used his license for recreational purposes, with other recreational users. Actually I only am irritated with the latter aspect, as it brings up a potential precedent for "friends" to effectively "charter" commercial boats out in a recreational role. It seems that Dan's crew were all his uh, crew, which isn't so bad, but it could very well have been a bunch of pal divers merely taking advantage of one dude's commercial license.

Fortunately Dan keeps up with NOAA press releases, and got his boat out just before they released this.

http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/fish/InNews/fishnews0262005.htm

I do not like the idea of a bunch of yahoo's reading the zeagle and spearboard posts about this and getting it into their heads that they can bribe or otherwise get a commercial operator to take them on what is essentially a recreational charter. I know some spearers and rod/reel fishers in Florida and Texas that would very much attempt this, if it could snag them some big fish. There's plenty of shallow water dive spots in federal waters where less qualified groups could go.

Well, be not bothered. This entire group is commercial. This was not a charter, it was not recreational. They knew the season was not closed before they went out. Every single aspect of this was entirely legal, there was no bribery or any other horse manure that you imply.

What some, as you call them, "yahoos" may or may not do is not a limiting factor. You might as well hold the position that daddy can't eat steak for dinner because baby can't have it, too. I as a recreational fisherman can't do what a commercial op can do. So what? I enjoy that which the laws permit me to do.

I do not surrender any lawful activity simply bc a criminal may abuse it. How is this any different?

 

[D_B]

why is this thread not locked and deleted already?

Now thats a troubling thought

DB

 

[CBulla]

why is this thread not locked and deleted already?

Under what basis? It's been quite an interesting discussion thus far.

 

[Chad Carney]

You need not worry about the spearfishing toll on Warsaw grouper.

In 33+ years of spearing in the 250 fsw range in Florida, I have yet to see one. A handfull of buddies have taken one over the decades, and I have been on only two of those boats when a Willey got bagged, from FL to TX.

It's a rare event in Florida and barely more common in oil rig country.
There has never been a Warsaw weighed in a Florida spearfishing tournament, and there are multiple tournaments per year with some pretty serious deep water shooters.

It's not rare because they are not out there... it's because they are deeper than most shooters care to dive. Even the Headhunter team has only done two of these 400'+ trips, and one was not shootable.

However, I've heard that longliners pull them in all the time.

Chad

 

[peterbkk]

Funny how so many outside of the US worry about what we do here without concerning themselve what goes on in their own backyards.

Right Peter? Should we start a thread of sins from your homeland?

Sorry but you are wrong. I do concern myself a lot with what goes on in my own backyard. (Actually my "homeland" is Australia which has a better-than-most track record on marine conservation).

I don't really see this as a "one country verses another country/region" issue. Surely ocean conservation should be a global issue.

As for Southeast Asia and Thailand, if you can find a way to help on marine conservation, please jump in. Thailand is only just becoming aware of these issues. It has taken a group of us concerned scuba divers 5 years, with a lot of private lobbying, to get the Thai navy involved in marine park protection and arrange some (limited) patrolling of the marine parks to deter commercial fishing boats.

Interestingly though, the Thai fishing industry is not so bad as others on the "by-catch" issue. Thai's eat all sorts of seafood and almost all the catch is sorted and used. Even the almost-inedible stuff goes into exported catfood and fishfarm food.

But, please do not get the impression that I am condoning the Thai fishing industry. It is as bad as all the others at over-fishing, damaging endangered species and fishing in places where they should not. They also have a nasty habit of stealing buoys off our marked dive sites. I personally support the Thai Navy and the Thai Royal Forest Department (they manage Marine Parks) in their effort to educate fishing communities. They use one of my DVDs that shows how beautiful marine life can be and how much damage certain types of fishing can cause.

Regards
Peter