Master Scuba Diver Certification

[SkimFisher]

It says, "Hey, I spent an assload of money with PADI and all I got was this stupid title."

 

[drrich2]

Is it really fair that while one diver takes rescue, buoyancy, deep, navigation, night and search/recovery to earn MSD another diver can take rescue, naturalist, photography, Nat. Geo. diver, shark diver, and Fish ID to earn MSD? Which one of these divers is truly closer to being a Master Scuba Diver?

I see your point. On the other hand, stepping up to Bachelor's degrees for a better range of options for comparison, if we come a B.S. in Chemical Engineering to a B.A. in Liberal Arts or a B.S. in Physics to a Bachelor's in Accounting or some form of Music (not sure how those are worded), do we have an equivalent? No. And many people who take general ed. course work for a degree recall very little years later, yet still hold the degree.

It's not a perfect analogy, Master Scuba Diver vs. a college degree, but there is some legitimate basis for comparison. Not all 'Master' Scuba Diver cert.s indicate equivalent training, but then, neither do all college degrees. And there is a 'shared core curriculum' of open water diver and rescue diver training, so even there, it's not completely arbitrary. People can take electives, or choose from different choices to meet requirements, pursing degrees.

Richard.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

I see your point. On the other hand, stepping up to Bachelor's degrees for a better range of options for comparison, if we come a B.S. in Chemical Engineering to a B.A. in Liberal Arts or a B.S. in Physics to a Bachelor's in Accounting or some form of Music (not sure how those are worded), do we have an equivalent? No. And many people who take general ed. course work for a degree recall very little years later, yet still hold the degree.

It's not a perfect analogy, Master Scuba Diver vs. a college degree, but there is some legitimate basis for comparison. Not all 'Master' Scuba Diver cert.s indicate equivalent training, but then, neither do all college degrees. And there is a 'shared core curriculum' of open water diver and rescue diver training, so even there, it's not completely arbitrary. People can take electives, or choose from different choices to meet requirements, pursing degrees.

Richard.

That is why there are Bachelor degrees with different notations like the ones you listed above. (Bachelor of Music, Bachelor of Arts or Bachelor of Fine Arts, by the way)

A Bachelor of Arts in Accounting at one school should be equivalent to a Bachelor of Arts in Accounting in another school. They are the same degree with the same name. I wouldn't expect a BA in Accounting to be equivalent to a BA in Library Science and certainly not equivalent to a BS.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

It says, "Hey, I spent an assload of money with PADI and all I got was this stupid title."

This is off-topic but reminded me of something I found today. PADI offers transcripts for many of its courses so that people can receive college credit for completing them. In order to receive the transcript, this form must be submitted along with the fee.

Transcript Request

I have been to four colleges now and while one of them does not charge at all for transcripts, the others charge no more than $5. PADI is charging $30?! For a paper copy of a transcript?!

 

[TMHeimer]

Aquatic Eagle, Thanks for the info. on double triangles/squares-thought it was something like that. Also for some clarification on NAUI. I didn't realize (5?) specialties were required by NAUI before starting MSD. Shows what I know.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

Aquatic Eagle, Thanks for the info. on double triangles/squares-thought it was something like that. Also for some clarification on NAUI. I didn't realize (5?) specialties were required by NAUI before starting MSD. Shows what I know.

NAUI MSD does not require that the student already possess five random specialties but requires that they master 5 fundamental areas. The five required areas are: emergency procedures/rescue, deep and simulated decompression diving, limited vis. or night diving, underwater navigation and search and recovery. The student (or class) can choose three other areas to learn and must take the required academic sessions and exam. The difference here is that NAUI is designating which five areas are most critical to become a MSD. PADI will let someone with any 5 specialties (and there are some pretty ridiculous ones out there) pay a fee and get the MSD card.

 

[TMHeimer]

NAUI MSD does not require that the student already possess five random specialties but requires that they master 5 fundamental areas. The five required areas are: emergency procedures/rescue, deep and simulated decompression diving, limited vis. or night diving, underwater navigation and search and recovery. The student (or class) can choose three other areas to learn and must take the required academic sessions and exam. The difference here is that NAUI is designating which five areas are most critical to become a MSD. PADI will let someone with any 5 specialties (and there are some pretty ridiculous ones out there) pay a fee and get the MSD card.

Clear up some more for me: In mastering these 5 fundamental areas (which I completely agree with), is a lot of the work pool work? It would seem 8 dives would not be near enough, though as you said, the instructor can require many more. Then after mastering these 5 areas is the diver awarded 5 specialty certifications like with PADI? While I may agree to a point that having some knowledge of areas that really don't do much for diver safety, efficiency, etc. may make a master diver more rounded in overall knowledge, I wish PADI would make the "core" ones required for MSD. I like to think I'm at least a little better MSD than someone with 5 "peripheral" specialties.

 

[theshred201]

At least in my experience for NAUI master diver, there wasn't really much pool work. Emergency procedures/rescue have pool practice from previous courses. If you'd like me to, later I might be able to write up a course report on my MSD course, but it was last year so I'll have to check my logbook and such for some of the details.

 

[oly5050user]

NAUI MSD does not require that the student already possess five random specialties but requires that they master 5 fundamental areas. The five required areas are: emergency procedures/rescue, deep and simulated decompression diving, limited vis. or night diving, underwater navigation and search and recovery. The student (or class) can choose three other areas to learn and must take the required academic sessions and exam. The difference here is that NAUI is designating which five areas are most critical to become a MSD. PADI will let someone with any 5 specialties (and there are some pretty ridiculous ones out there) pay a fee and get the MSD card.

PADI requires advance ow and rescue along with 5 specialties.
In advance diver gets experience with deep and navigation. Search/recovery experience is in Rescue,as patterns are used -as in the navigation dive for advance-to find a "missing diver". Depending on which full specialties,that are chosen,which are more formal with academic and ow training, than the 5 dives for advance class have ,a diver can get quite a bit of experience with the right instructor.
Its not the agency,its the instructor and how well he/she communicates required skills to student..I have seen awful PADI-NAUI-SSI-CMAS-BSAC the list goes on and on.If a student of mine did adv/rescue/5 specialties with me and and wants a MSD card I'll pay for the card.Costs the student nothing.
For myself its a thankyou and giving recognition to my student for all the work they have put in.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

Clear up some more for me: In mastering these 5 fundamental areas (which I completely agree with), is a lot of the work pool work? It would seem 8 dives would not be near enough, though as you said, the instructor can require many more. Then after mastering these 5 areas is the diver awarded 5 specialty certifications like with PADI? While I may agree to a point that having some knowledge of areas that really don't do much for diver safety, efficiency, etc. may make a master diver more rounded in overall knowledge, I wish PADI would make the "core" ones required for MSD. I like to think I'm at least a little better MSD than someone with 5 "peripheral" specialties.

There is specific requirement for pool work. That is left up to the instructor to decide.

I think that it should require more than 8 dives for most students. I guess there are students that have a ton of experience in varied areas and for that student, 8 would be enough. NAUI likes to give instructors a lot of freedom to add requirements so that's why it isn't more.

The diver is not awarded any certification other than MSD (if he finishes). NAUI has a strict "no double-dipping" rule. A training session can only be applied towards one certification. If a dive includes fish ID, navigation exercises and a wreck survey, it cannot count as a dive towards Underwater Naturalist, Underwater Navigator and Wreck Diver (External Survey). It can only count for one of them.

I am definitely not saying that those other specialties aren't important. I just think that there are some that are critical and then there should be some room for just interesting and fun electives.