Rudeness at Joe's Quarry by another lds

[MikeFerrara]

Why would one go to a quarry during student high-tide and expect vis!

Maybe because you have Saturday and Sunday off work like most every one else.

I doesn't matter how much time is spent training in a pool prior to OW check dives.

I disagree. It matters very much how much time is spent in the pool and what is taught there. It's more than possible to teach a class without trashing the site. I've done it and I've seen others do it. Shops, instructors and agencies choose to not teach the skills that enable a student to avoid stiring up the bottom. Just because most don't doesn't mean that they can't.

 

[icyman]

Maybe because you have Saturday and Sunday off work like most every one else.

I disagree. It matters very much how much time is spent in the pool and what is taught there. It's more than possible to teach a class without trashing the site. I've done it and I've seen others do it. Shops, instructors and agencies choose to not teach the skills that enable a student to avoid stiring up the bottom. Just because most don't doesn't mean that they can't.

1. Your missing several points here though, it wasn't the bottum that got stirred up, it was the swim throughs.

2. We were trying hard not to stir it up. But were forced to dive around the other group as they were having a convention or so it appeared.

3. To attack a person in front of a class is unexcusable.

4. What was the ultimate purpose in the attack? What good did it serve?

5. Did her behavior help students in their dealing with other SCUBA divers?

6. Was she a good example for the students?

 

[CincyBengalsFan]

This instructor is 100% out of line. Since she is the owner of this soon to be out of business dive shop, the agency should get wind of this matter.

As far as Viz goes, never expect good viz. If you are looking and expecting good viz you will be disapointed often. Those divers that moan and groan to everyone about bad viz should take up skydiving or something with great viz. A sport that can listen to these whiny sports enthusist.

I've built and placed the two largest platforms in at Joe's on the opposite side of LDC side. Never once did I consider them anything more than community. I never considered them mine or my groups.

Sorry to hear about this unfortunete experience at a great place. Just keep this in mind, half of the world are A-holes. The good news is that the other half is not.

 

[MikeFerrara]

1. Your missing several points here though, it wasn't the bottum that got stirred up, it was the swim throughs.

I've never seen those swim throughs but the agency might also be interested in hearing about those.

4. What was the ultimate purpose in the attack? What good did it serve?

I certainly can't even guess.

5. Did her behavior help students in their dealing with other SCUBA divers?

6. Was she a good example for the students?

I wonder.

 

[MikeFerrara]

This instructor is 100% out of line. Since she is the owner of this soon to be out of business dive shop, the agency should get wind of this matter.

I'm not sure the agency has anything to say about it.

As far as Viz goes, never expect good viz. If you are looking and expecting good viz you will be disapointed often. Those divers that moan and groan to everyone about bad viz should take up skydiving or something with great viz. A sport that can listen to these whiny sports enthusist.

Certainly bad vis happens but why is it unreasonable to expect divers and instructors to try to avoid it.

Maybe the instructors teaching trench digging should take up sky diving and then we'd all have good vis. Who knows they might even be good at sky diving?

 

[icyman]

I'm not sure the agency has anything to say about it.

Certainly bad vis happens but why is it unreasonable to expect divers and instructors to try to avoid it.

Maybe the instructors teaching trench digging should take up sky diving and then we'd all have good vis. Who knows they might even be good at sky diving?

It appears to me your implying in this instance he was teaching them to be on the bottum, your mistaken if that is the case.

As I said before in a positive manner he had just spoke to everyone reinterating to stay off the bottum before she began her unprofessional tyrade.

 

[MikeFerrara]

It appears to me your implying in this instance he was teaching them to be on the bottum, your mistaken if that is the case.

I don't know the instructor so I can't imply anything. I have however watched countless instructors who didn't teach divers not to be in the bottom and I am intimarely familiar with agency standards that don't require them to teach divers to stay out of the bottom.

 

[icyman]

I don't know the instructor so I can't imply anything. I have however watched countless instructors who didn't teach divers not to be in the bottom and I am intimarely familiar with agency standards that don't require them to teach divers to stay out of the bottom.

Oh well, I was mistaken about your reply, I guess you were generalizing about the instructor teaching trench digging taking up skydiving and in this case it doesn't fit.

As I said before this instractor has constantly told everyone in the class about their bouyancy. He takes great care to try to aviod disturbing vis.

So your saying that you think that her behavior is acceptable though?

 

[Maladryne]

So your saying that you think that her behavior is acceptable though?

No... what he actually said was

The agencies and instructors just don't get it or they don't care. I'm not sure what's left but to call them on it in gront of the students they're supposed to be teaching.

At this point, it simply comes down to a matter of opinion. We don't know the "backstory"; maybe she has on repeated prior occasions seen the instructor in question doing exactly the same thing, and has on those occasions responded by quietly taking him aside and talking to him. This time, though, she lost her temper and decided, as the above quote suggests, to "call him on it in front of his students". I'm not saying that's what happened, I have no idea. The question is, is there ever an occasion when it's justifiable to berate an instructor in front of a class. Personally, I don't think so. The professional thing to do is take them aside, and if that doesn't work, talk to their supervisor/boss, agency, or the owner/operator of the location where the incident occurs.
I've had occasion to have a quiet word with a fellow instructor, and choosing to do so in a forthright but professional manner makes a huge difference; rather than the incidents blowing up, the other individuals have uniformly thanked me for according them the courtesy and respect I showed them, and acted responsibly. I'm not so naive as to think that this would always be the case, but it's certainly my default.

To each his own.

 

[MikeFerrara]

So your saying that you think that her behavior is acceptable though?

I guess I'm saying that from your description this instructor didn't have any room to talk. In general though I think it depends on the situation. I've seen instructors do some dangerous things and it's the students who need to know. Having a polite game of footsie off in the corner with the instructor may or may not solve anything.

Also since I am no longer active in the dive industry I just don't care anything at all about being professional. If I feel there is something I have to say to a group of divers I'll say it. The fact that one is an instructor and the others are students is of no consequence to me.

Again, in ths case I wasn't there.