SP Hydros Pro vs Halcyon Eclipse

[eelnoraa]

Worth of value is really in the eye of the beholder. One extreme is people value functionality only. The other extreme is people value things beyond functionality, say the extra step in build quality, the fit and finishes,... etc. Then there is everyone else somewhere in the middle. The argument against Halcyon or Hydros with DSS can easily be make against DSS with say DGX or DRIS bp/w package. If OP is on budget, then I won't suggest Halcyon at all. But if OP has the budget for Halcyon, I will say go for it. It is pricey, but it does back it up with the attention to detail. DSS is also great if that is what you want. In fact, DRIS trianta wing/HOG setup is also great. It really is a personal preference at this point

 

[BoltSnap]

Worth of value is really in the eye of the beholder. One extreme is people value functionality only. The other extreme is people value things beyond functionality, say the extra step in build quality, the fit and finishes,... etc. Then there is everyone else somewhere in the middle. The argument against Halcyon or Hydros with DSS can easily be make against DSS with say DGX or DRIS bp/w package. If OP is on budget, then I won't suggest Halcyon at all. But if OP has the budget for Halcyon, I will say go for it. It is pricey, but it does back it up with the attention to detail. DSS is also great if that is what you want. In fact, DRIS trianta wing/HOG setup is also great. It really is a personal preference at this point

 

[eelnoraa]

I haven't looked at a Tecline in person. But, one of the DMs that assisted with my AN/DP class, and whom I have continued to dive with since then, has a SP X-Tek BP/W. Looking at that, it seems like the wing shell material is not as robust as other wings I have. In particular, my Dive Rite Rec EXP, Oxycheq Vertex Extreme, Halcyon Explorer (don't have anymore) and even my Hog wings all seem like a more durable material. The X-Tek seemed comparable to the old DSS LCD wing and the old OMS wings I have/had. I even noticed on his X-Tek wing (which did not look old or abused at all) had a seam coming apart with about a 1/2" hole showing.

I'm not saying the X-Tek is bad. Not at all. I'm just saying it seems to me there are better quality wings on the market and often for less cost.

This I can support. I have use X-tek double donut wing in a class. Yeah, I don't think they are as well designed in general as DSS, Oxycheq or Halcyon. You can get better for less money

 

[mattia_v]

I haven't looked at a Tecline in person. But, one of the DMs that assisted with my AN/DP class, and whom I have continued to dive with since then, has a SP X-Tek BP/W. Looking at that, it seems like the wing shell material is not as robust as other wings I have. In particular, my Dive Rite Rec EXP, Oxycheq Vertex Extreme, Halcyon Explorer (don't have anymore) and even my Hog wings all seem like a more durable material. The X-Tek seemed comparable to the old DSS LCD wing and the old OMS wings I have/had. I even noticed on his X-Tek wing (which did not look old or abused at all) had a seam coming apart with about a 1/2" hole showing.

I'm not saying the X-Tek is bad. Not at all. I'm just saying it seems to me there are better quality wings on the market and often for less cost.

I don't disagree. My Tecline feels nicer, but both are pretty new right now, so can't really say either is showing much wear 50 dives in.

 

[tbone1004]

Almost all of what you advocate and mention is about cheap, not value. BP/W rig you mention is a totally different type of a rig compared with the Hydros, it isn't apples to apples comparison at all. As for quality, I have a couple of SP BC's that I have owned since circa 2000 and with thousands of dives on them and they are going strong even after I put them into the training/rental fleet. The other SP BC's I have in the rental/training fleets are also going strong when other brands are falling apart. We are replacing all of the "other" brands with SP BC's as we speak.

so if I start advocating for Halcyon the table turns because it's an $800 bp/w instead of a $500 bp/w?
I have a Transpac and wing from the late 90's that I inherited with 2500 logged dives on it, I've put at least 200 on it since then and it's still going just fine. I have seen DSS rigs with ~2000 dives on them that are close to a decade old and still going fine. Longevity of a product, especially one that is 20 years old when the company has changed radically since then is not an indicator of current build quality nor does it represent value.

so I ask again. What does a Hydros Pro get me for a 60%/$300 increase in cost?

 

[tbone1004]

T, for once, I have to disagree with you on this one. I have used this DiveRite QLR weight pickets. These are pretty bad design. Their mountain mechanism is really for DiveRite Transplate/Transpac harness. They go on the smaller plates holding the shoulder harness to the waist strap. If you mount on just the 2" webbing, these thing will slide around. The 2" metal triglide won't keep it in place. The worst aspect is weight (2lb bullets or even lead shot) will fall out from the pockets. Unless they changed the design recently. Also, at that cost, it is already Halcyon territory and at last the H ACB works well.

thanks for pointing that out. I haven't seen the Halcyon pockets, but they're similar pricing so yeah, pick your poison on that. If the ACB works better, then go for that instead, can't go wrong with either.

 

[BullDiver]

Are different brand backplates compatible with different brand wings? For example, is a Halcyon harness compatible with a DSS wing and vice versa? Just out of curiosity.

I'm not sitting on loads of money but if I'm buying something that's going to last a long time I'm willing to make an investment. Still messing around with my options hoping to find what works best for me.

 

[tbone1004]

Are different brand backplates compatible with different brand wings? For example, is a Halcyon harness compatible with a DSS wing and vice versa? Just out of curiosity.

I'm not sitting on loads of money but if I'm buying something that's going to last a long time I'm willing to make an investment. Still messing around with my options hoping to find what works best for me.

best to buy the whole kit at once, no way you will save money buying the pieces separately.

Harnesses are all universal and largely the same. Some slight differences in the webbing, but that is cheap.

Backplates use a standard 11" center that Dive Rite established ~25 years ago. Basically all doubles wings will mount on all backplates *there may be exceptions, but I haven't found or heard of one*

Where it gets a bit weird is if the backplate is designed without the use of an STA *also a Dive Rite invention actually*, and making sure the wings and backplate slots line up. Halcyon uses STA's exclusively and their wings require the use of an STA. They are universal across all backplates because of the 11" center spacing
DSS single tank wings are mostly universal so long as the backplates have multiple bolt holes that will line up with the rubber grommets that they use to mount the wing to the plate so the cam bands don't have to be unthreaded to remove the wing for cleaning/storage/travel.

 

[eelnoraa]

Adding to what Tbone has said. If you are looking at STAless setup, DSS has very good design implemented, just get the whole set. If you go with Halcyon Small plate, you have to have a STA because H small plate doesn't have cam slots. Strangely, H regular size plate has cam slots to.

After that, backplate also have different bend angles to them. From the very flat DSS plate to very deep bend HOG plate. It is all personal preference here. I myself had to give quite a few tries to get to what I want. The good thing is the harness can easily be re-used, and it is very easy to sell a backplate with minimal depreciation. I can't say the same for conventional BCDs.

 

[BoltSnap]

so if I start advocating for Halcyon the table turns because it's an $800 bp/w instead of a $500 bp/w?
I have a Transpac and wing from the late 90's that I inherited with 2500 logged dives on it, I've put at least 200 on it since then and it's still going just fine. I have seen DSS rigs with ~2000 dives on them that are close to a decade old and still going fine. Longevity of a product, especially one that is 20 years old when the company has changed radically since then is not an indicator of current build quality nor does it represent value.

so I ask again. What does a Hydros Pro get me for a 60%/$300 increase in cost?

No, you are attacking better products for cheaper sideline business type. As it was pointed out earlier, there are markets for cheap/budget stuff and there is market for high end brand name equipment.

What you get for a brand name such as SP, a company that has been in business for much than you have been around with cumulative worldwide experience that exceed sideline home business. You can count on SP anywhere in the world not the others. The innovative features the Hydros BC brings and the RD that spanned several years cost money and only a company of the stature of SP can afford to do it, not the hobbyist part time wanna be playhouse side-liner types.

It is one thing not to be able to afford to pay $300, but to attack its value and contributions to diving is totally something different. I can't afford it now and probably won't be able to afford it in the coming months but I don't attack it to lower its value.