Ya know, you can get the rip cord system for a BPW. At least the Zeagle BPW. You can also take any one piece harness and add a buckle at the shoulder to get out. ala our old plastic back packs. You might sacrifice a d-ring location. I am happy to see you are doing your due diligence. Don't pull the trigger yet. I don't think you need the cinch system. Maybe a buckle at the shoulder. Keep in touch.Oh and another few questions: (thanks for being patient)
I have an issue with one of my hands (right) from an injury in war (US Veteran) so the rip cord system on the Stiletto appeals to me for ease of use. With a BP/W, I like the Cinch system from H for similar reasons (I can push the webbing with my right Palm and slide out if needed).
I know that you can buy the Cinch System from H for about $100. Can I put that kit onto ANY other BP or does it NEED to go onto a H plate?
Are the wings interchangeable for the different companies plates?
Say I get the H Cinch webbing kit, will I be able to put that on a DSS plate and use ay Wing?
Thanks again everyone. I really appreciate it.
Money is very tight so I need to stretch it as far as I can
Good Rec (Maybe Tech) BP/W
- Thread starter USVet96
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Thank you all for your input thus far and I am learning what I need to (some at least lol)
Some digging I have done has pointed out that the Cinch is only compatible with the H plates (I believe there may be a model or 2 that works ok but is not designed for it)
Also, I will be doing 95% of my dives in tropical salt water. When I dive now, with a 1 mil suit I use 6lbs in the pockets and 2 in the trim (with a skin and a 1 mil (if I'm chilly lol) I will use 8lbs plus the 2 trim)
One of the things with the BP/W that also appeals to me is is I go SS then I should be able to completely eliminate the weights I'm using now (granted I will not have any ditch able weight but I can manage Im pretty sure - and in a really grave emergency I will just dump the whole rig) - or go with an AL plate and weight pockets on the BP/W
I can see that it seems the majority of parts are interchangeable with one another - minus a few pieces and players that do not play well with others (usually the case)
I guess I need to do a more critical analysis of each piece of the kit (BP and W) to figure out what small intricacies on each part are, or will be, important to me and my diving style in the future; and then proceed to compare like parts by different manufacturers to find the best deal I can.
It seems to me that it will be better for me, and I believe (on the surface at least), to be less expensive (not cheaper - nothing in diving is ever cheap lol) than buying an entire kit.
It also seems that DSS makes better wings, Halcyon better harness, and everyone makes decent plates lol.
Thank you all for your input thus far and I am learning what I need to (some at least lol)
Some digging I have done has pointed out that the Cinch is only compatible with the H plates (I believe there may be a model or 2 that works ok but is not designed for it)
Also, I will be doing 95% of my dives in tropical salt water. When I dive now, with a 1 mil suit I use 6lbs in the pockets and 2 in the trim (with a skin and a 1 mil (if I'm chilly lol) I will use 8lbs plus the 2 trim)
One of the things with the BP/W that also appeals to me is is I go SS then I should be able to completely eliminate the weights I'm using now (granted I will not have any ditch able weight but I can manage Im pretty sure - and in a really grave emergency I will just dump the whole rig) - or go with an AL plate and weight pockets on the BP/W
I can see that it seems the majority of parts are interchangeable with one another - minus a few pieces and players that do not play well with others
(usually the case)I guess I need to do a more critical analysis of each piece of the kit (BP and W) to figure out what small intricacies on each part are, or will be, important to me and my diving style in the future; and then proceed to compare like parts by different manufacturers to find the best deal I can.
It seems to me that it will be better for me, and I believe (on the surface at least), to be less expensive (not cheaper - nothing in diving is ever cheap lol) than buying an entire kit.
It also seems that DSS makes better wings, Halcyon better harness, and everyone makes decent plates lol.
Thanks Split for the advise (as well as thank you to everyone else)
I totally forgot about that release option from Zeagle on their BP/W. I may not need the Cinch you are right. But just to give you an idea about myself, I was in the military and did a Spec Ops job for many years. While in the Middle East years ago I got pretty hurt on a jump (tore up my ankle and leg real bad - even today after 4 surgeries) and also during a hello cast (split my right hand in two and almost lost half of it - even to this day I can't close my right hand properly and haven no movement in my last 3 fingers on that right hand). While in the service I did dive as part of my job. As a result of my injuries I could no longer do my job effectively (without risk) (ie - humping a ruck, jumping, diving, fast roping, running 20 mi, etc) so I had to either reclass and do a different job (no thanks) or get out of the military.
Long story short bud is that because of my injuries I stayed away from the water for a long time because I was not comfortable with my abilities to help someone else in the water if they needed aid, and myself if I got into trouble. I wasn't sure if my body was physically able to do it - like dumping weights (remember i cant close my hand) and removing my kit. Through the years I've gotten stronger, mentally and physically, and am back in the water.
Thing is though that now some of the things I do and don't do, and the equipment decisions I now make, unlike before the injuries, are all guided by other factors. So I have tom find the best gear for me and my situational needs.
Sorry for the long post - just wanted to explain why I am so interested in the weights and the weight release options.
I totally forgot about that release option from Zeagle on their BP/W. I may not need the Cinch you are right. But just to give you an idea about myself, I was in the military and did a Spec Ops job for many years. While in the Middle East years ago I got pretty hurt on a jump (tore up my ankle and leg real bad - even today after 4 surgeries) and also during a hello cast (split my right hand in two and almost lost half of it - even to this day I can't close my right hand properly and haven no movement in my last 3 fingers on that right hand). While in the service I did dive as part of my job. As a result of my injuries I could no longer do my job effectively (without risk) (ie - humping a ruck, jumping, diving, fast roping, running 20 mi, etc) so I had to either reclass and do a different job (no thanks) or get out of the military.
Long story short bud is that because of my injuries I stayed away from the water for a long time because I was not comfortable with my abilities to help someone else in the water if they needed aid, and myself if I got into trouble. I wasn't sure if my body was physically able to do it - like dumping weights (remember i cant close my hand) and removing my kit. Through the years I've gotten stronger, mentally and physically, and am back in the water.
Thing is though that now some of the things I do and don't do, and the equipment decisions I now make, unlike before the injuries, are all guided by other factors. So I have tom find the best gear for me and my situational needs.
Sorry for the long post - just wanted to explain why I am so interested in the weights and the weight release options.
@Blue Sparkle.
I didn't think I was making blanket statements, sorry if it seemed that way.
I was pointing out specific aspects that I had direct comparisons for. In regards to the waist belt buckles, it may be a minor point but it does show one more area where DSS took the time to include a heavier buckle.
The other buckles used by other companies will work fine, they only have to clamp down a piece of webbing. But DSS does in fact use a buckle made from thicker stainless than the others.
I've seen the Halcyon ones and they are made from the same stamped thin stainless that my Dive Rite was made out of. I also have a few generic buckles and one branded Omer Sub that is the same thin metal. I bought them for keeping a can light in place.
They all work fine, but everyone I have or have seen is the same thin metal compared to the heavy DSS one. It's not that important, they all clamp webbing just fine.
**I just grabbed a micrometer and measured all of the buckles I have.
Omer Sub, generic buckles, and Dive Rite are all 0.057", my DSS buckles are all 0.101" thick. For reference 0.125" is 1/8".
So DSS is making their buckles from a thickness of metal that is almost as thick as their plates. Overkill...maybe. Attention to detail.....I think so.
-Mitch
I didn't think I was making blanket statements, sorry if it seemed that way.
I was pointing out specific aspects that I had direct comparisons for. In regards to the waist belt buckles, it may be a minor point but it does show one more area where DSS took the time to include a heavier buckle.
The other buckles used by other companies will work fine, they only have to clamp down a piece of webbing. But DSS does in fact use a buckle made from thicker stainless than the others.
I've seen the Halcyon ones and they are made from the same stamped thin stainless that my Dive Rite was made out of. I also have a few generic buckles and one branded Omer Sub that is the same thin metal. I bought them for keeping a can light in place.
They all work fine, but everyone I have or have seen is the same thin metal compared to the heavy DSS one. It's not that important, they all clamp webbing just fine.
**I just grabbed a micrometer and measured all of the buckles I have.
Omer Sub, generic buckles, and Dive Rite are all 0.057", my DSS buckles are all 0.101" thick. For reference 0.125" is 1/8".
So DSS is making their buckles from a thickness of metal that is almost as thick as their plates. Overkill...maybe. Attention to detail.....I think so.
-Mitch
This for USvet96
I know. I've read your other posts. But, I honestlly don't believe you need the cinch system, but maybe a simple quick release on the harnes. I know a couple divers..one without a hand and the other without an arm. They actually managed a single piece harness. I have two arms and two hands, but I honestly found I can manage a harness with a release on the shoulder better than I can without. But..I CAN manage a one piece harness, so I do.
I still say you are doing it right. Take it slow.
I know. I've read your other posts. But, I honestlly don't believe you need the cinch system, but maybe a simple quick release on the harnes. I know a couple divers..one without a hand and the other without an arm. They actually managed a single piece harness. I have two arms and two hands, but I honestly found I can manage a harness with a release on the shoulder better than I can without. But..I CAN manage a one piece harness, so I do.
I still say you are doing it right. Take it slow.
Pull and Blue - Thanks for the advice and info. BOTH make great points and I appreciate all of the time you have spent helping to educate me on this subject. I don't want you two upset and bickering, well as long as it's not personal and informational I'm ok with it and btw Mitch, anything you want to sell lol.
Split - thanks for reading the posts and knowing the background. I also appreciate you taking the extra time to know what all the facts are.
The one-shoulder quick-release might be a better option yet. Have to do more research on it and see what's what. The main thing with me is being comfortable again in the water. It's taken some time to get back to that comfort level for me but it's still steps forward so I'm ok with that. And that's comfortable with me, my gear, and my buddies diving with me.
I may be over thinking the cinch system. I guess I need to get some hands on time with something in the water and see where I want improvements to be. Then find something with what I'm looking for in a product.
For example if a standard harness with a quick release on an AL plate and a 30 wing is ok, then go for that and find those pieces to the exact specs I'm looking for. Or, using that setup, realize I want A or B and then find that.
But I'm making good strides in the right direction.
Thanks again to ALL of you here on SB. You are a wealth of info and experience.
USVet
and btw Mitch, anything you want to sell lol. Split - thanks for reading the posts and knowing the background. I also appreciate you taking the extra time to know what all the facts are.
The one-shoulder quick-release might be a better option yet. Have to do more research on it and see what's what. The main thing with me is being comfortable again in the water. It's taken some time to get back to that comfort level for me but it's still steps forward so I'm ok with that. And that's comfortable with me, my gear, and my buddies diving with me.
I may be over thinking the cinch system. I guess I need to get some hands on time with something in the water and see where I want improvements to be. Then find something with what I'm looking for in a product.
For example if a standard harness with a quick release on an AL plate and a 30 wing is ok, then go for that and find those pieces to the exact specs I'm looking for. Or, using that setup, realize I want A or B and then find that.
But I'm making good strides in the right direction.
Thanks again to ALL of you here on SB. You are a wealth of info and experience.
USVet
US Vet,
I don't have anything for sale at the moment, sorry.
Blue Sparkle and I weren't bickering, I probably did come across as just making blanket statements. He was just pointing it out.
Have fun on your search for that new BC.
-Mitch
Ya know Vet, you can purchase a one piece harness really economically. 12 or 14 ft of 2 inch webbing. If you have issues, cut it and install a buckle on the shoulder. If that does not work, then you can invest the big bucks. You're in Miami. So you'll go from a rash guard to a 3 mil, maybe a 5 mil. I really think you'll be fine in a single 1 piece HOG harness. Don't focus on buying gadgetry. (tough, I know.)
cool_hardware52
Contributor
eelnoraa
Contributor
I do agree DSS is a high quality produce. But I do found your reply biased, many points are inaccurate. I have 3 wings now, Oxycheq, DSS, Halcyon, one each. Here is what I have to say.
This isn't true. DSS 22u vs Oxycheq 26.5u.
It is hard to say which is toughtest. But based on the outter shell thickness, Oxycheq Signature V fees tougher but less flexible. Oxy wing retains it shape better even when the wing is empty. Not for DSS
Fast draining mesh at the bottom vs. grommets.
All three of my wing has SS grommet. I use my Oxycheq the most, no sign of corrosion after 2 years.
The DSS OPV is much better that the (sourced from ???) that everyone else uses. The ones that were all recalled for bad springs. I put a DSS OPV on my Oxycheq.
This is BS. I haven't encount any SS buckle that gives me problem, including no brand plain SS buckle from DGX.
This is also inaccurate. I would say DSS wing's cut is more inline with H, HOG. They all can be folded flat. Oxycheq has a very different cut, more 3D. It cannot be folded flat. And because of Oxycheq's special cut, it is the most streamline wing. But I also suspect it may not be the easiest to vent.
The inner bladder of my DSS wings is properly sized to the outer shell. My Oxycheq seems to be a 55 lb. bladder stuffed inside of a 40 lb. shell. There are other posts here describing the same.
DSS, Dive Rite, HOG are about the same flatness. OMS and H have higher degree of band. This is strictly a personal preference. Flatter plate put the tank closer to one's body. I found it is abit too close. My head hit 1st stage. I much prefer a steep band of my OMS over my DiveRite
So as HOG and Oxycheq. I do agree that DSS mounting mechanism is better than other that I have.
DSS plates come in a few different lengths, and the have the molded in rubber pieces which mean you don't need to use tri-glides to lock in your webbing adjustment.
So as many other. The only over stiff crotch strap is from DiveRite.
Again, I do agree DSS makes high quality product. I have no problem recommanding it. But to say DSS is the king, others are crap is a unfair statement.
To me DSS's advantages over other are these:
1)Tobin's knowledge, support and service
2)Different size backplate if that is what you need.
3)ability to add weight on to the plate, especially if you dive in cold water.
4)the wing attachement mechanism allow you to take wing off without rethreading tank band when not using STA
This isn't true. DSS 22u vs Oxycheq 26.5u.
It is hard to say which is toughtest. But based on the outter shell thickness, Oxycheq Signature V fees tougher but less flexible. Oxy wing retains it shape better even when the wing is empty. Not for DSS
Fast draining mesh at the bottom vs. grommets.
All three of my wing has SS grommet. I use my Oxycheq the most, no sign of corrosion after 2 years.
The DSS OPV is much better that the (sourced from ???) that everyone else uses. The ones that were all recalled for bad springs. I put a DSS OPV on my Oxycheq.
This is BS. I haven't encount any SS buckle that gives me problem, including no brand plain SS buckle from DGX.
This is also inaccurate. I would say DSS wing's cut is more inline with H, HOG. They all can be folded flat. Oxycheq has a very different cut, more 3D. It cannot be folded flat. And because of Oxycheq's special cut, it is the most streamline wing. But I also suspect it may not be the easiest to vent.
The inner bladder of my DSS wings is properly sized to the outer shell. My Oxycheq seems to be a 55 lb. bladder stuffed inside of a 40 lb. shell. There are other posts here describing the same.
DSS, Dive Rite, HOG are about the same flatness. OMS and H have higher degree of band. This is strictly a personal preference. Flatter plate put the tank closer to one's body. I found it is abit too close. My head hit 1st stage. I much prefer a steep band of my OMS over my DiveRite
So as HOG and Oxycheq. I do agree that DSS mounting mechanism is better than other that I have.
DSS plates come in a few different lengths, and the have the molded in rubber pieces which mean you don't need to use tri-glides to lock in your webbing adjustment.
So as many other. The only over stiff crotch strap is from DiveRite.
Again, I do agree DSS makes high quality product. I have no problem recommanding it. But to say DSS is the king, others are crap is a unfair statement.
To me DSS's advantages over other are these:
1)Tobin's knowledge, support and service
2)Different size backplate if that is what you need.
3)ability to add weight on to the plate, especially if you dive in cold water.
4)the wing attachement mechanism allow you to take wing off without rethreading tank band when not using STA
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