Regs on ebay?

[+Jon+]

?

 

[halocline]

Even the lower end, less expensive regs are built with the same basic technology and will serve you better than an old reg that who knows where it's been or came from. Technology has come a long ways and if you buy a good name brand, you are ahead of the game....

I disagree with some of this statement. It's true that inexpensive regs are just as safe as their high performance counterparts. But, old regs are often times just as good or better than current models by the same company. I bought a reg off ebay because I specifically wanted a 2nd stage that's not longer made; the older style G250. IMO this reg outperforms it's "upgrade" G250HP because it has a metal air barrel rather than the plastic barrel found on most new regs. As long as you get an old reg rebuilt by someone who knows what they're doing, it will be every bit as reliable and safe as a new reg. There are a few classics out there that were discontinued solely due to marketing considerations; the only way to get them is used.

Now, ebay may not be the best place to buy used stuff, but you should have no concerns about buying a used reg (maybe better from a local source where you're face to face with the buyer) provided, as many have said on this thread, that you know what you're looking for and you figure in the cost to get it it rebuilt.

For instance, there's a very reputable tech who frequents this board who recently said he was selling off a few of his older SP regs; he would be an ideal source because he'd expertly service it before selling, and did not buy the regs to sell, but to dive with and eventually accumulated too many.

 

[Creed]

Even the lower end, less expensive regs are built with the same basic technology and will serve you better than an old reg that who knows where it's been or came from. Technology has come a long ways and if you buy a good name brand, you are ahead of the game...

Yeah, this is pretty much false. Hell, the AL Titan(for example) uses the same damn parts that the Conshelf series has used for decades, in the same configuration. Are you telling me that a brand new regulator, sold by one of the oldest and most respected equipment companies in the world, is junk? If it is, then tell me why I should trust ANY company with my life. And if it's not, then how can you paint older regs that share the exact mechanics as the Titan with such a broad brush? Have some technologies evolved a lot in the last few years? Sure. Computers for example. Cameras, for another. Regulators? Not so much. In fact, I consider the use of plastic 2nds to be a downgrade, and many "innovations" to be fixes for poor design decisions to begin with(like the use of plastic in a 2nd).

Look, I understand that you are trying to help people and protect your income, but you don't need to spread falsehoods to make your point. A new diver should not be buying on ebay without a LOT of research, and it takes a fair amount of experience to even know when you have that knowledge. I've steered students(not mine, they just talked to me) away from used gear for that very reason, even though they watched me walk in with 5 ebay regs for testing at the pool after a rebuild.

 

[scubapro50]

Yeah, this is pretty much false. Hell, the AL Titan(for example) uses the same damn parts that the Conshelf series has used for decades, in the same configuration. Are you telling me that a brand new regulator, sold by one of the oldest and most respected equipment companies in the world, is junk? If it is, then tell me why I should trust ANY company with my life. And if it's not, then how can you paint older regs that share the exact mechanics as the Titan with such a broad brush? Have some technologies evolved a lot in the last few years? Sure. Computers for example. Cameras, for another. Regulators? Not so much. In fact, I consider the use of plastic 2nds to be a downgrade, and many "innovations" to be fixes for poor design decisions to begin with(like the use of plastic in a 2nd).

Look, I understand that you are trying to help people and protect your income, but you don't need to spread falsehoods to make your point. A new diver should not be buying on ebay without a LOT of research, and it takes a fair amount of experience to even know when you have that knowledge. I've steered students(not mine, they just talked to me) away from used gear for that very reason, even though they watched me walk in with 5 ebay regs for testing at the pool after a rebuild.

AQUALUNG (known as U.S. Divers for many years) has supported most of their regulators with parts or upgrades. But remember that not all their stuff is in good or excellent condition especially the models from the 50's and 60's . Regulators built by them from the mid 70's thru the late 90's have much in common with todays models and thus many parts are interchangeable .... GREAT ..... but let the "newbie" once again beware of not knowing what he is buying ...... some early models are so worn in both age and design that they are "collectors" pieces and should stay on the wall. It's best to ask questions about which regulators are rebuildable and at what cost. Yes the basic technology hasn't changed much but there have been improvements in materials and overall designs ..... look at the new metals now available, the sealed 1st stage units, the safe 2nds and octs, smaller and lighter in weight that have longer life spans and fewer service problems, and don't forget the higher tank pressures and the "clean" regulators designed for mixed gases. There are differences and depending on how and where you buy and use the "older" stuff will determine if it was a good deal or not.

 

[H2OSensei]

Yeah, this is pretty much false. Hell, the AL Titan(for example) uses the same damn parts that the Conshelf series has used for decades, in the same configuration. Are you telling me that a brand new regulator, sold by one of the oldest and most respected equipment companies in the world, is junk? If it is, then tell me why I should trust ANY company with my life. And if it's not, then how can you paint older regs that share the exact mechanics as the Titan with such a broad brush? Have some technologies evolved a lot in the last few years? Sure. Computers for example. Cameras, for another. Regulators? Not so much. In fact, I consider the use of plastic 2nds to be a downgrade, and many "innovations" to be fixes for poor design decisions to begin with(like the use of plastic in a 2nd).

Look, I understand that you are trying to help people and protect your income, but you don't need to spread falsehoods to make your point. A new diver should not be buying on ebay without a LOT of research, and it takes a fair amount of experience to even know when you have that knowledge. I've steered students(not mine, they just talked to me) away from used gear for that very reason, even though they watched me walk in with 5 ebay regs for testing at the pool after a rebuild.

I'm not saying that every new reg is better than any old reg. I'm simply saying that most of the new regs are built with current techology and will perform better than SOME of the old regs out there. There's always the classics, but for a newbie, I thnk they're better off buying a new reputable reg,

 

[Creed]

AQUALUNG (known as U.S. Divers for many years) has supported most of their regulators with parts or upgrades. But remember that not all their stuff is in good or excellent condition especially the models from the 50's and 60's . Regulators built by them from the mid 70's thru the late 90's have much in common with todays models and thus many parts are interchangeable .... GREAT ..... but let the "newbie" once again beware of not knowing what he is buying ...... some early models are so worn in both age and design that they are "collectors" pieces and should stay on the wall. It's best to ask questions about which regulators are rebuildable and at what cost. Yes the basic technology hasn't changed much but there have been improvements in materials and overall designs ..... look at the new metals now available, the sealed 1st stage units, the safe 2nds and octs, smaller and lighter in weight that have longer life spans and fewer service problems, and don't forget the higher tank pressures and the "clean" regulators designed for mixed gases. There are differences and depending on how and where you buy and use the "older" stuff will determine if it was a good deal or not.

I fully understand this. Like I said, the new diver SHOULD go to their LDS.Any reg, regardless of age, can be damaged or worn with poor care, and it takes a good deal of knowledge to know when to play the odds on a used reg. My issue was with the idea that the techology has changed enough to warrant disregarding all old regs. This simply isn't true.

I honestly don't think that the new metals and such are real innovations. Why pay the extra amount for titanium(for example) when brass meets or exceeds the same design specs at a much lower cost? And cleaned regs for most mixed gases is simply a matter of swapping out o-rings and using the proper lubrication(and even that, I would argue, is not needed in most cases, as the regulator should never see anywhere near 100% O2). And I would say that the vast majority of new divers will be running 3000psi for their max air supply, which most regulators from the mid-60's onwards would be completely safe at.

So, I guess my point is, yes, new divers should listen to their LDS. But give them real reasons to buy new, and not an old saw that just isn't true.

 

[Weddas]

I have got all my dive kit off ebay. all works great. ill give you the brand of my regulator "proformance diver" a really solid reg and have had no problems with it so far. and got it for 145.00 AUS
really happy with the reg
hope you get a deal like mine
all the best of luck
chris

 

[H2OSensei]

I fully understand this. Like I said, the new diver SHOULD go to their LDS.Any reg, regardless of age, can be damaged or worn with poor care, and it takes a good deal of knowledge to know when to play the odds on a used reg. My issue was with the idea that the techology has changed enough to warrant disregarding all old regs. This simply isn't true.

I honestly don't think that the new metals and such are real innovations. Why pay the extra amount for titanium(for example) when brass meets or exceeds the same design specs at a much lower cost? And cleaned regs for most mixed gases is simply a matter of swapping out o-rings and using the proper lubrication(and even that, I would argue, is not needed in most cases, as the regulator should never see anywhere near 100% O2). And I would say that the vast majority of new divers will be running 3000psi for their max air supply, which most regulators from the mid-60's onwards would be completely safe at.

So, I guess my point is, yes, new divers should listen to their LDS. But give them real reasons to buy new, and not an old saw that just isn't true.

I think you're either missing my point, or I shouldn't be writing responses at 1:00 am. My response has nothing to do with protecting my income. I spend plenty of money on advertising and don't need to do so on this board. I'm only trying to be helpful and give the new diver a perspective from somebody who see's regs from all over the place come through my store for service, day in and day out.

Let me be ballsy and make an anology (and hope I don't get ripped a new one). If your teenage daughter was buying her first car, and you were trying not to spend a boatload of money... wouldn't you rather she buy a new economy, reliable car than a used car from eBay? Who knows where that car has been? Did the previous owner take good care of it? Was the oil changed frequently? Do they still make parts for it?

I just had a guy today who bought a used reg set online. He thought he got this great deal until he found out what it was going to cost with the service and parts. He could have purchased a BRAND NEW Scubapro MK2/R295 which is a respectable regulator for the same price.

The point of this post was to answer the original question from the new diver and make him aware that there are lots of potential issues with buying a used reg online.

My issue was with the idea that the techology has changed enough to warrant disregarding all old regs. This simply isn't true.

I never said that old regs should be disregarded, I was merely stating that unless you are a veteran like yourself who knows his regs, a new diver buying an old regulator on eBay is taking unecessary chances with his safety and his investment, when he can buy a new reputable reg with a warranty (and in the case of Scubapro free parts for life).

 

[Creed]

I think you're either missing my point, or I shouldn't be writing responses at 1:00 am. My response has nothing to do with protecting my income. I spend plenty of money on advertising and don't need to do so on this board. I'm only trying to be helpful and give the new diver a perspective from somebody who see's regs from all over the place come through my store for service, day in and day out.

That's what I said.

Like I said, the new diver SHOULD go to their LDS.

Oh, and I'm the wrong person to talk to about cars. My children will likely start off with older VWs that we've rebuilt together as a learning project.

The point of this post was to answer the original question from the new diver and make him aware that there are lots of potential issues with buying a used reg online.
I never said that old regs should be disregarded, I was merely stating that unless you are a veteran like yourself who knows his regs, a new diver buying an old regulator on eBay is taking unecessary chances with his safety and his investment, when he can buy a new reputable reg with a warranty (and in the case of Scubapro free parts for life).

I agree. And I concede the point, since I just went back and saw that the person in question had less than 15 dives. I stand by my advice for those who do bid on ebay.

The reason I got a little testy was that I've had people try that argument on me.I've had shops refusing to fill older steel tanks with a current hydro and vis. I've had to explain to LDS workers that a Conshelf XIV 2nd is perfectly functional. I've had a shop owner tell me that a manifold was non-standard( he was completely wrong, and I had it rebuilt at another shop that didn't even carry that brand because it was all standard parts on the inside). Or the "unrebuildable" regulators that require only a new o-ring. Don't even get me started on the misconceptions about double hose technology. So, that argument triggers bad things for me.