List of dive destinations to not go to...

[robint]

Sinbad - once again you can not see the forest for the trees.

What makes this ONE PERSON'S OPINION the be all opinion for EVERY diver????

What one person thinks is GREAT diving may be CRAP for another diver. We are not all the same and do not want the same. This is not Stepford.

edit: And also...... everyone who works at a dive shop has not been to every destination or is reliable. It is their opinion they give out, nothing more. My LDS is run by a complete dip**** and I have heard him lie to sell a trip over and over. I used to work there, so I got to listen to his wild stories on a daily basis. Once I returned from a trip and told him something that happened to us. The very next day I heard him repeat my story to a customer saying it had happened to HIM. REALLY.... do not believe everything you hear at any dive shop! That was one big reason I quit, couldn't deal with his BS anymore.

 

[drrich2]

What makes this ONE PERSON'S OPINION the be all opinion for EVERY diver????

It's not. By way of analogy, years ago (when I was single), a friend of mine, empathizing with the difficulties of eliciting a woman's favor, told me (regarding approaching women I had no prior acquaintance with) 'Women hate pick up lines, but pick up lines are all you've got.'

No doubt a lot of people would argue that. Not worth derailing the thread to hash out.

The point is, other peoples' opinions, like pickup lines, are imperfect, don't work for everybody, etc, etc..., but when you have a number of places you've never been to to choose from for your next dive vacation...odds are you're going to ask some people about it, read forum postings on it, maybe some online reviews. Other peoples' opinions may be a lot of what you've got.

And often, the most helpful are the ones with even handed criticism comparing it to other dive destinations.

Someone once posted about diving in Bermuda, a destination that doesn't seem to be a big dive vacation draw. Since he invited questions about it, I basically laid out what I'd be looking at to, oh, say, dive the Bahamas, so with that frame of reference, I asked why someone would go to Bermuda (not to attack it; the inquiry was sincere).

Richard.

P.S.: Responding to Mathauck0814.

Well, that's inspiring.

It can be. Years ago, when I bought my '02 Chevy Malibu, I was pleased as punch that I could use the remote to lock & unlock it. Kinda like how some people diss Bonaire diving as unremarkable, but I love it. You can have a lot of fun in a Honda Accord, if your standards aren't too high! And a lot of us will never drive a Porsche (besides, I'm to cheap to buy one whether I can afford it or not).

 

[eelnoraa]

Well, Honda accord is not necessary the most economical, pratical, get you from A to B car any more. A decently equiped model is like $25K. High end model touches Audi and BWM price. I am thinking Honda Fit here, not that anything wrong with Honda Fit. I love mine for commuting and local diving.

So an Accord trip isn't compatible to a LOB on a backpacker's boat on Thailand, which get your probably most diving for the money. I went by myself in Thailand on such type of boat, I truely enjoyed it. But if I were to go again with family, I will pick a more confortable boat.

To borrow from Eelnoraa's analogy, there are a lot more people driving Honda Accords than Porches. And I suspect a lot more North Americans hitting Buddy Dive in Bonaire than Wakatobi. Price & measurable qualities are a big part of how many vacations are chosen. Otherwise more of us would be hitting Wakatobi, based on reviews (I haven't been; cost & travel time being measurable qualities at issue).

Wonder what Sinbad drives? My everyday car is an Accord. And majority of my trips are "Accord" trips but I still try to take the "Porche" out for a spin every couple of years.

 

[chillyinCanada]

Rich, don't be dissing Honda Accords! The 4 bangers might not be much but the V6 howls.

 

[scubafanatic]

Rankings are always insulting Robint. Think about “10 Most Violent Places in the World!” No matter how you make that list, someone will be insulted because you are objectifying subjectivity. “20 Most Beautiful Women in Hollywood” is another brawl waiting to unfold.


When I walk into my LDS, I see a TRIP SCHEDULE advertising that years trips along with the prices. It reads as follows:


Bonaire 850 USD + Airfare


Belize as 2100 + Airfare.


I want to know from the LDS why I should pay 1250 USD more to go to Belize? Is Belize that much better? Since 1250 USD difference in price is a lot of money, I would hate open ended answers like “Every destination has something to offer!” or “You really can’t compare one dive destination to another before you actually go there etc.” Excuse me but that sales-person crap better be thrown at the next guy who walks in. If you want to make me 1250 USD poorer, you better have some damn good reason. Try selling an auto-mobile with the same lines that dive shops are using to market destinations and no one would fall for such nonsense! Ask your auto dealership “Why does this BMW cost more than Honda Fit?” Imagine if the salesman (instead of actually comparing features) tries to tell you that “Every car is different and there really is no way for you to know unless you become the owner of all vehicles so just buy this one and start driving OK???” Thus when the LDS salesman tries to pull this “politically-correct dive-destination BS,” I am sorry but I am really not falling for it.


Here is what an honest conversation from an honest LDS would sound like:


Customer: Why does Belize cost so much more than Bonaire? Is the diving there that much better than what I can have in Bonaire?


LDS Salesman: There really is not a lot of difference between Belize and Bonaire and really nothing worth for you to spend 1250 bucks on. The reason why they are priced differently is because Bonaire is shore diving and does not involve boat rides, crew costs etc. Belize tries to give you the same kind of diving but uses boats and boats come with fuel and crew costs so your cost for the same type of diving would be 1250 bucks more if you go to Belize!


WHOAAA!!! Imagine what a disaster it would be for the whole dive industry if LDS people started giving honest answers such as this??? That is why any such list does not go well with a lot of people. Here is another brutally honest conversation you will never hear in a dive shop!


Customer walks in: Hello! I see you have a trip going to Australia that is 6200 with airfare and another one going to Komodo Island in Indonesia for 5100 with airfare. Is Australia really that much better than Komodo island?


LDS Sales person: Not at all! Well you see the dive prices are less connected to the quality of diving and more connected to the local economy. The cost of diving in Australia is higher because Australia is a developed first world economy so when you dive their reef you pay first world prices. It costs a lot of money for an Australian to buy a boat and set up a dive shop in Cairns Australia than it does for an Indonesian to do so in Indonesia. Are you still interested in going to Australia???


WHO LET THE DOGS OUT WOOF WOOF WOOF!!!


Dive destinations will start to vanish from the map if such brutally honest and politically-incorrect conversations started to happen. Unfortunately I am the consumer in the dive industry, not a tour operator, LDS owner or liveaboard owner and this is exactly the world that I would like to create. Anything other than this is insulting to me.

If you're comparing Bonaire to a Belize liveaboard trip, I'd GLADLY pay $ 1250 more for Belize! I've been to Bonaire twice ( 2 1-week trips) and Belize once (Sun Dancer), and enjoyed all 3 trips, but wouldn't return to Bonaire. Your LDS Bonaire trip is very bare-bones pricing, doesn't include food, $ 15 - $ 20/gal (US) gasoline prices for your rental truck, etc. If you included the REAL costs of a non-inclusive, land-based Bonaire trip to the ALL inclusive Belze/Sundancer trip, Bonaire would be just as expensive, and a liveaboard is WAY easier and vastly more relaxing! My trips to Bonaire felt as if I had a new job at a moving company as chief pack mule!

 

[Wingy]

After 13 pages of this thread, comparing dollars and pesos and kms and miles ive come to a conclusion. No ones list is going to make any difference to me at all - I expect the Caribbean to be less than optimum diving from what I have heard and seen so far, (and to dive the Caribbean for me is like diving Ningaloo reef to a New Yorker if we are going to bring it down to cost and distance) then when I am travelling the area when I do a trip to central america etc I shouldn't bother diving? Or should I only dive Cocos, Socorro, Galapagos and Fernando whatever its called??. If i include the REAL costs of flying to Costa Rica and diving Cocos then it best be good diving, because it would cost me around 25K. Does that preclude it from being on my to dive list? no. Does the fact everyone ive seen dive say Indonesia after the Carribean says the diving is way less colorful dictate that I shouldnt bother with say TCI?, no.
People dive for different reasons, to me, its part of every trip but not always the sole reason for a trip. Bhutan doesnt have an ocean but I still intend to visit there one day. One thing this thread and the cozumel threads clearly show are the volume of divers at those destinations which will affect my decision on where to dive when im in the area.

 

[mathauck0814]

One thing this thread and the cozumel threads clearly show are the volume of divers at those destinations which will affect my decision on where to dive when im in the area.

Probably the observation of the thread right there.

 

[luckydiver]

Probably the observation of the thread right there.

humm, not sure what the heck that is supposed to mean but my curiosity is up...

a) the poster is going to avoid like the plague all the overcrowded heathen infested party animal places, AKA 'those destinations', that everyone else is babbling on about
b) or he thinks he's gotten invaluable insight into dive sights he doesn't want to pass up if in the neighborhood based on the glowing commentary

karma wheel is spinning but no idea where it lands on this one...

 

[Wingy]

Actually the poster is a she, and it was A - I do not like overcrowded all in inclusive party theme night type destinations. I prefer diving more remote areas not just because I wish to avoid package resorts from a dive perspective but also from a top side perspective. I am an independent traveler who writes for independent travel sites (i.e. not booked via any agency planning and booking everything myself and researching what in the region I want to see both subsea and topside) and this thread has given me a good insight into the places I tend to avoid. I have dived some of the places on the not to go to list and enjoyed them immensely - PNG was worth every cent for me. I like drift diving but Cozumel is firmly crossed off my list because I dont want a concrete resort putting a wrist band on me nor do I like boats with 18 divers on them, or dive sites that end up with 6 or 7 boats on the one site. Personal preference. I dont use a dollars and cents analysis to work out where im headed next. Dont worrry about Karma, its all balanced - Im a buddhist

 

[WOODMAN]

What's a nickel rocket? I might like them of I knew what they were...

This is a bit late in this discussion, but I just got around to reading it. Anyway, a nickel rocket is someone who looks for the cheapest way to do something, regardless of any other consideration, such as value received for money spent, etc. A lot of this discussion centers on cost issues, and rightfully so. This is an expensive hobby:coolingoff:, and value issues are of prime concern to a lot of us. Letting cost drive you to the exclusion of any other concern, however, is a good way to stab yourself in the back. There are some wonderful bargains out there- (see my trip report for Eagle Point resort in the Phillippines for a good example, and Reef House resort in Roatan also comes to mind), but there are significant travel issues with a lot of the good cheaper stuff. Well, you pays yer money and takes yer choice, I suppose. Research here has helped me immeasurably to make the best use of my limited resources, and I thank all of you again for the invaluable help you have given me over the years. I may not exactly qualify as a "nickel rocket", but I understand the mentality. I am definitely an "Accord diver" and proud of it.