List of dive destinations to not go to...
- Thread starter CAPTAIN SINBAD
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
Wingy
Contributor
drrich2
Contributor
Wingy:
I think I see your point, but a lot of the divers this thread should appeal to are in something of a different boat, so to speak. Let me explain.
Many divers get certified and aren't part of a dive club and don't know many other divers. It may be one person, or a guy and his friend or wife (in my case, a friend and a wife). Once he realizes most rivers, lakes and ponds have crappy viz., and the ocean is where he's going to find those great coral reefs with great viz. as seen on t.v., he wants to go!
But where? For most of North America, that means either the Bahamas or the Caribbean. But there are many places you could go. People talk about Cozumel and Bonaire a lot (if you're on this forum and notice!), but what about all these other places - Grand Turk, St. Lucia, Saba, etc... Oh, sure, you can say 'go read about them,' but to a newbie, it can feel like your brain is going to melt and run out your ears trying.
You've gotta thin the pile of options. Galapagos - the 'best' diving is cold water & has currents; advanced. It's out. Bahamas - water's cool in winter & I'd need a wet suit; that's out (in winter). Grand Cayman is more expensive than Cozumel, fine boat diving at either - for me, at least, G.C. lower on the list. And so on.
As a related example, I recently decided to plan a trip to the Florida Keys. Just figuring out which island, dive shop and hotel, and what my options were, was quite a hassle. I finally posted and got some help with it. Key Largo, Rainbow Reef Dive Center, Courtyard Marriot is right beside it, water should still be warm enough in the next few weeks for me to dive without a wetsuit (75 degrees is my low for that), and so it goes...
My point is, a thread like this can direct relative newbies to the 'best value' Honda Accord-type diving trips, and over time, as they learn and advance, they can move on to second & third tier sites.
One more analogy - how many of you had a Porsche for your first car when you were a teenager?
Richard.
I think I see your point, but a lot of the divers this thread should appeal to are in something of a different boat, so to speak. Let me explain.
Many divers get certified and aren't part of a dive club and don't know many other divers. It may be one person, or a guy and his friend or wife (in my case, a friend and a wife). Once he realizes most rivers, lakes and ponds have crappy viz., and the ocean is where he's going to find those great coral reefs with great viz. as seen on t.v., he wants to go!
But where? For most of North America, that means either the Bahamas or the Caribbean. But there are many places you could go. People talk about Cozumel and Bonaire a lot (if you're on this forum and notice!), but what about all these other places - Grand Turk, St. Lucia, Saba, etc... Oh, sure, you can say 'go read about them,' but to a newbie, it can feel like your brain is going to melt and run out your ears trying.
You've gotta thin the pile of options. Galapagos - the 'best' diving is cold water & has currents; advanced. It's out. Bahamas - water's cool in winter & I'd need a wet suit; that's out (in winter). Grand Cayman is more expensive than Cozumel, fine boat diving at either - for me, at least, G.C. lower on the list. And so on.
As a related example, I recently decided to plan a trip to the Florida Keys. Just figuring out which island, dive shop and hotel, and what my options were, was quite a hassle. I finally posted and got some help with it. Key Largo, Rainbow Reef Dive Center, Courtyard Marriot is right beside it, water should still be warm enough in the next few weeks for me to dive without a wetsuit (75 degrees is my low for that), and so it goes...
My point is, a thread like this can direct relative newbies to the 'best value' Honda Accord-type diving trips, and over time, as they learn and advance, they can move on to second & third tier sites.
One more analogy - how many of you had a Porsche for your first car when you were a teenager?
Richard.
Well if that's how we should be interpreting this thread, it sure took a long time for someone to characterize it that way. Instead of provocatively titling the thread "Destinations Not to Go," asking for "Best-Value Destinations From Your Hometown" might have sent us down a more narrow and constructive path.
For me in Atlanta, the Keys are where I go when I want a Value destination rather than an exotic and expensive destination. The Keys have that semi-tropical feel and reasonably interesting stuff to see, yet a long weekend can be done relatively economically from here.
robint
Contributor
Exactly my point.... my first trip to Bonaire was fabulous, but weather was perfect so we could dive ANY dive site we wanted. Our second trip was boring in that regard as we were restricted due to HIGH winds. If the second trip had been my first, I might never go back. It was okay, lots of fish (see my videos), but not the diversity I enjoy in reef structure or fishlife. I am glad I had that first fantastic trip, or I wouldn't be recommending Bonaire to people as the cost would be too high for MY value ratio.
That is why I say you should NOT paint ANY DESTINATION with a broad stroke. Times of year, weather conditions, crowds, boat crew, other divers, or even the individual reefs visited, etc. can make or break a trip.
Examples:
Cozumel a few years ago we had wind and rough seas, chilly norte action in March, it was a real adventure getting back on the boat, currents were freaky. The divers on our boat were awesome so we still had a blast... diving was not as great as other trips, but we didn't care. It was the only trip there I experienced weather as a factor in diving, 7 other trips were stellar.
NC wreck diving in Morehead City, rough seas are the norm. We got blown out 2 days in a row, finally got to dive 2 days after that. It is a long 2 hour ride is 3-5' seas all the way out, 2 hour surface interval, then 2 hours back to port. People were seasick (not us) and complaining like babies (didn't they do any research before the trip?), and the vis was bad due to the bad weather for 2 weeks prior, but we had a FANTASTIC trip. Expensive all day event for only 2 dives, those long bumpy boat rides, and 20+ people on a boat with some hanging over rails the whole time could have ruined it for us. But it didn't. Is this a trip I would recommend? Only to people I know are UP to it. Diving is awesome, but it is not for wimps or newbies.
Totally agree with you and Eelnoraa.
I think where the thread starter annoyed people is his choice of words: "destinations to avoid" and assigned many top places with that label.
Then again, he admits he wanted to create some controversy.
Many people own Accords, but they dream about owning a Porsche. Many divers vacation in the Caribbean, but they dream about Indonesia.
I'm sorry that I temporarily bought into Rich's car analogy because a Belize dive trip can be had in the Porche category or in the Honda Fit category.
OP
CAPTAIN SINBAD
Contributor
Rankings are always insulting Robint. Think about “10 Most Violent Places in the World!” No matter how you make that list, someone will be insulted because you are objectifying subjectivity. “20 Most Beautiful Women in Hollywood” is another brawl waiting to unfold.
When I walk into my LDS, I see a TRIP SCHEDULE advertising that years trips along with the prices. It reads as follows:
Bonaire 850 USD + Airfare
Belize as 2100 + Airfare.
I want to know from the LDS why I should pay 1250 USD more to go to Belize? Is Belize that much better? Since 1250 USD difference in price is a lot of money, I would hate open ended answers like “Every destination has something to offer!” or “You really can’t compare one dive destination to another before you actually go there etc.” Excuse me but that sales-person crap better be thrown at the next guy who walks in. If you want to make me 1250 USD poorer, you better have some damn good reason. Try selling an auto-mobile with the same lines that dive shops are using to market destinations and no one would fall for such nonsense! Ask your auto dealership “Why does this BMW cost more than Honda Fit?” Imagine if the salesman (instead of actually comparing features) tries to tell you that “Every car is different and there really is no way for you to know unless you become the owner of all vehicles so just buy this one and start driving OK???” Thus when the LDS salesman tries to pull this “politically-correct dive-destination BS,” I am sorry but I am really not falling for it.
Here is what an honest conversation from an honest LDS would sound like:
Customer: Why does Belize cost so much more than Bonaire? Is the diving there that much better than what I can have in Bonaire?
LDS Salesman: There really is not a lot of difference between Belize and Bonaire and really nothing worth for you to spend 1250 bucks on. The reason why they are priced differently is because Bonaire is shore diving and does not involve boat rides, crew costs etc. Belize tries to give you the same kind of diving but uses boats and boats come with fuel and crew costs so your cost for the same type of diving would be 1250 bucks more if you go to Belize!
WHOAAA!!! Imagine what a disaster it would be for the whole dive industry if LDS people started giving honest answers such as this??? That is why any such list does not go well with a lot of people. Here is another brutally honest conversation you will never hear in a dive shop!
Customer walks in: Hello! I see you have a trip going to Australia that is 6200 with airfare and another one going to Komodo Island in Indonesia for 5100 with airfare. Is Australia really that much better than Komodo island?
LDS Sales person: Not at all! Well you see the dive prices are less connected to the quality of diving and more connected to the local economy. The cost of diving in Australia is higher because Australia is a developed first world economy so when you dive their reef you pay first world prices. It costs a lot of money for an Australian to buy a boat and set up a dive shop in Cairns Australia than it does for an Indonesian to do so in Indonesia. Are you still interested in going to Australia???
WHO LET THE DOGS OUT WOOF WOOF WOOF!!!
Dive destinations will start to vanish from the map if such brutally honest and politically-incorrect conversations started to happen. Unfortunately I am the consumer in the dive industry, not a tour operator, LDS owner or liveaboard owner and this is exactly the world that I would like to create. Anything other than this is insulting to me.
Your understanding of the world is truly breathtaking.
Similar threads
- Question
