Recommendations for divemaster course in Thailand

[jkaterenchuk]

Nah, didnt miss any of that.
Why is there this condescending attitude that I've missed something? Thanks for that.

To be blunt....because you have.

Should ALL dive pros know how to set up a shot line because there are some dudes out there doing deep tec diving?
And are the rest of us useless, unskilled, liabilities in whatever field we decide to follow because we dont have skills that are completely unrelated

Not because there are some dudes doing tec dives but rather because it might:

1) Might give you an edge over the 100's of other candidates seeking the same dive profession position in the future.
2) Might help your customers not miss a day of diving when you pull up to the recreational wreck that they have been looking forward to diving only to find that some Thai fishman stole the buoy and rope.
3) Makes you better well rounded dive professional and allows you to speak about issues with some personal knowledge.

No not useless, unskilled or liabilities......just not a knowledgeable as others whom embrace learning new skills.

John

 

[InDaWata]

Wow. ...

Ive obviously hurt some feelings to earn a reply like these last few.
Sorry then John, youre absolutely right! I dont embrace learning ANYTHING. I *hate* books. Skule is for lozers. And furthermore I am advocate of the movement "Dive Professionals Should Know As Little As Possible" aka - DPSKALAP

I never would have known how to solve the problem you mentioned on the other page because, obviously, you need to go through a whole training course to figure it out. I would have never known how to handle a cold diver becaue I never took the drysuit diver course!

Starting from today, I am going to go out and collect every card I can.
Starting with PADI- "Boat Diver" ... or maybe "Skin Diver" because without those Im just not complete as a pro- no matter what Im doing!

 

[penguintom]

Surely whatever your proffession anyone can see that knowledge and skills gained makes you better at your job regardless of how frequently you actually practice the skills you know.
As jkaterenchuk points out you never know when you might need a skill in the future even if it is simply to advise.
I see a comment about doing courses and collecting cards, this is not the only way you can develop skills, things can be learned on your way through life by having an open mind and dialogue with others on the way, rather than taking the line, I have the card so I know everything already.
Some of the comments I have read in the last few posts do not surprise me at all given my experiences last year, indeed I can see traits of those that I was so dissatisfied with.
Regardless of how old we are and how experienced we think we are, you should still be prepared to listen to others and learn sometimes.

 

[InDaWata]

penguintom,
I agree completely. I cant understand how people should resort to becoming condescending towards others and such. It doenst help to create an atmosphere of discussion, or professionalism. Sorry for the sarcasm earlier, but i felt it was warranted.

Knowledge and skills gained makes you better at your job if they are applicable to your job at that point. If they are not, than I do not subscribe to the elitism displayed by others who think that lacking esoteric skills (at that time) cripples or disqualifies that professional from operating within their current capacity.



Thanks!

 

[jkaterenchuk]

Thanks!

Your welcome.

You jumped in and expressed an opinion and I responded in a specific and logical way....if you found that elitist or condescending that is truly unfortunate for you.

I guess to old saying still holds true.....you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

John

 

[stiggy]

Diving experience skills and knowledge count simple as that.

As for tropical diving is always easy...to make a statement like that a person hasnt had a lot of experience in a tropical enviroment.

Try the Down currents that occur in Indo for example ,or some of the wrecks buried in a thick thermocline.

Plus the whole cold water divers are tougher ..um dont you all wrap up in furry bear suits then do everything possible to not get wet.

Ask Jamie he had a diver poking a research cameras in dark deep holes for the Navy in just his pants last year,Now thats tough..

 

[penguintom]

I certainly and I dont think others have said one type of diver is better than another, you seem to be reading things differently to myself stiggy.
I just feel those that have training and experience in a wider variety of conditions wherever they may be and regardless of temperatures clearly make for a more knowledgable and experienced diver, or instructor as the case may be.

 

[lord khram]

I have trained divers and instructors all over the world, and my impression is that divers/instructors that have done all their training in just one type of enviroment never become better than a mid tier instructor as they dont have experience in varied enviroments.. Divers from different enviroments have different base skill sets, warm water only divers tend to have better buoyancy control than their cold water only counterparts.. where as I find most warm water divers have relatively poor navigation skills and depend on good viz to get them around...

But its not just warm vs cold, you also need exposure to enviroments where the entry/exit point has to be the same (like being tied into a wreck), as well as being able to do a drift exit/ entry... Professionals that dont have adequate experience in varied conditions can't transfer this knowledge to their students effectively..

for example I am a cold water diver and most of my students are avid wreck divers, they mostly come to me with a specific skill set, when they ask me to do advanced training like extended range or Trimix I usually suggest we go to a warm water destination so that we can push runtimes and I can ensure that they have other skills that they may need to use in the future...

I find that the cold water divers are usually more relaxed while out of their element than the reverse.. I find its ALOT easier to work with cold water divers in a warm water enviroment than the other day around.. I remember about 15 years ago or so that I invited a warm water trained instructor that insisted that he could dive and train in any enviroment up to ny to do a relative easy wreck dive (and good conditions.. verry little current and 10-15ft viz) on one of the sites we use for training.. I had him "lead" as if he was the instructor... after a few minutes it was clearly evident that he was VERY nervous.. at our agreed upon turn time I signaled to him its time to go back.. he immediately started to progress in the wrong direction.. If he was leading a group of divers we probably would have had a rescue on hand... even after I pointed him in the right direction, he failed to recognize where we were and swam right past the anchor line.. He also felt that a pony bottle was an unnecessary item, but he was glad when he had one to use (mandated by boat) after he was OOg..

I am not saying warm water diving can't be challenging (I have had some very hard warm water dives) but what is usually the exception is the norm off places like the UK and NE USA..

even the similiarites there for conditions the diving style is VERY different.. In the NE we all tie into the wreck and the diver MUST go up and down the anchor linem whereas in the UK most of the diving is done from ribs and its free ascent/deco.. These require different skill sets as well and experience is needed in the other enviroment before you can take responsibility there..

Nice to see someone with a straightforward common sense approach on here for once. Learning anything is never wasted effort. You never know when you might benefit from or need that knowledge.

 

[stiggy]

My opening statement was.

Diving experience skills and knowledge count simple as that.

Im not reading anything different PT nor am I stating any type of diving is better.

The rest of the post is in humor and poked at my Cold water buddies that also read this board.

One of them claims to be a cold water diver yet uses a hot water suit (surface supplied diver) when working in the North Sea, looks like a boiled lobster when he comes to surface.In fact how he can call himself a diver when he dosent even wear fins is beyond me ,he is winched down films some metal then winched up again.

Took him diving in the tropics and spent the whole time telling him to put his fins on and stop walking everywhere.

 

[InDaWata]

...if you found that elitist or condescending that is truly unfortunate for you.

No? well, I felt that it was... especially when considering the bulk of the comments.

-To be blunt....because you have.
-if you found that elitist or condescending that is truly unfortunate for you.
-I would say your narrow perspective prevents you from seeing the broader picture.
-...or you would give her a bunch of BS you pulled out of your ass.
-I guess you have rather limited wreck diving experience.
-I guess you missed the entire point...

Resuming the point.
Im not quite sure what argument everyone thinks Im advocating. I have never said that professional divers shouldnt learn new skills. Im not saying that we should keep a closed mind and refuse to learn, so I dont know who these comments are aimed at...

-I guess to old saying still holds true.....you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
-earning anything is never wasted effort. You never know when you might benefit from or need that knowledge.
-

Again, my whole point on commenting in the first place was to draw light to what I feel has not been addressed;

Knowledge and skills gained makes you better at your job if they are applicable to your job at that point. If they are not, than I do not subscribe to the elitism displayed by others who think that lacking esoteric skills (at that time) cripples or disqualifies that professional from excelling within their current capacity.

It would be nice if all professionals living and working in SE Asia had the time/money/leisure to go out and do some ice diving courses. Maybe they could spend a few months diving the St. Lawrence river. Maybe even take a blended gas course. What the hell- who whouldnt? Given the time/money/leisure, again...

But for all practical reasons, and despite what anyone says- there ARE esoteric skills that do not enhance some dive professionals' useful skill set and it seems on ridiculous to maintain that they cant excel without those skills. If you earn a meager living as a full time dive pro (and you DO), why should you spend your time/money/leisure collecting certs you dont use, especially if you dont intend on changing locations or responsibilities?

Ive got a few friends who live permanently out in different resorts- what are they going to do with courses such as "Ice Diver," "Cave Diver," or Trimix certs?
But I tell you what- as far as instructors go- they will for damn sure do an excellent job teaching within their chosen field.

If you dont work full time as a dive pro, and have lots of capital to spend, why not hop around and get as much experience as you can? You will definitely be "better" in some respect.