How to pick a BP/W?

[cool_hardware52]

"How 'bout to a little pre trip research and discover before you leave **what** tanks are available?"

I did. That's why I took both plates.

"Sticking a +4 lbs "cork-like" al 80 on my back while using a near neutral (al or kydex backplate) then hanging 4-6 lbs around my waist basically defeats one of the key advantages of a BP&W."
And
"If you are buying one back plate in almost all cases a Stainless Steel plate is the best choice for both home and travel."

I'm really happy with the ss plate and aluminum tanks and 4 pounds on my belt. But if I have a steel tank, what do you suggest?

Humm, -6 lbs of steel plate and harness, -4 lbs of lead, -2 lbs of regulator and a buoyant (+4 empty) al 80 leave about 8 lbs of ballast to sink your exposure suit.

vs

- 6 lbs of steel plate and harness, "0" lead, -2 lbs of regulator and a empty HP100 (-1~-2) That equals about 9-10 lbs of ballast to sink your exposure suit.

If you manage to get your total weighting correct within 1 lbs you are doing better than most. Just avoid the stupidly negative steel tanks.

Tobin

 

[cool_hardware52]

There are of course combination's of gear that will leave a diver using a SS plate over weighted, typically thin exposure suits and negative steel tanks.

One can always cite unlikely examples, but for the most commonly encountered configurations, 7mm or drysuit + steels at home in cold water, and 3mm suits and al80's while traveling, the SS plate makes sense.

If one is trying to buy one set of gear with the widest possible application it's useful to focus on the commonly encountered tanks, not the exception.

In cold water diver's need a lot of ballast, a single tank diver in 7mm suit or drysuit is much better served with a SS plate.

Tobin

 

[it_mike]

Just use SS!

I don't bounce back and forth. I can handle a few extra pounds if need be, and save the headache of managing two plates on vacation.

 

[RAWalker]

There are of course combination's of gear that will leave a diver using a SS plate over weighted, typically thin exposure suits and negative steel tanks.

One can always cite unlikely examples, but for the most commonly encountered configurations, 7mm or drysuit + steels at home in cold water, and 3mm suits and al80's while traveling, the SS plate makes sense.

If one is trying to buy one set of gear with the widest possible application it's useful to focus on the commonly encountered tanks, not the exception.

In cold water diver's need a lot of ballast, a single tank diver in 7mm suit or drysuit is much better served with a SS plate.

Tobin

While I agree that is most configurations a SS plate makes sense there is a number of hard facts that can lead away from SS to a lighter material. Considering just single tank configurations not doubles.
1) A great many divers are warm water divers that travel. In this case weight is at a premium and 5# and over SS backplates use 10% or more of a checked bag's weight allowance.
2) While you can add weight to lighter plate you can't easily remove it from a heavier one.
3) Having little or no dumpable weight and relying on the lift capacity of a sausage or lift bag (as some have suggested) is IMHO not mediating risk well.

So considering the above if you are looking for only 1 plate... I'd have to consider your warmest water configurations. you can always add weight to pockets and/or a weight belt for trim and buoyancy and most dive ops you'll visit while traveling will supply weight.
For wing choice I agree that the coldest water configuration is the controlling factor. While these two considerations are opposite sides of the spectrum there are some wings that will work. This will leave the diver with a rig that is less than optimal in most cases but also completely safe and reliable for the greatest range of conditions.

I myself at this point have 2 wings (30# Oxycheq and 45# OMS bungie) and 2 plates (5.5# SS and 1# AL) I also dive in conditions that range from 49F to 90F in both fresh and saltwater so far always wet but I expect a drysuit in my future and mostly with AL80 singles but I have dived with an AL100 and have a LP108 on order. I also am starting to look to doubles (twin AL80) With the 45# bungie wing. It's rated as a dual purpose wing. I've found the bungies to control both the air movement within the wing and the taco effect for single use.

 

[OldNSalty]

Hey! OP here, I have found a few folks locally who are willing to let me look at their set up which will be great. I am still trying to educate myself on these things and I have another question-The webbing: It looks like you can have 1 long section of 2" webbing threaded and cut to size where I can mount as many or as few D rings as I want to-And anywhere I want to OR some super padded stuff - I would imagine that its not as flexible in D ring placement. So what are the advantages/disadvantage-The padded stuff looks more comfortable but is it defeating a point of the BP/W? Some look so padded that its hard to tell them from more a traditional BC.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Hey! OP here, I have found a few folks locally who are willing to let me look at their set up which will be great. I am still trying to educate myself on these things and I have another question-The webbing: It looks like you can have 1 long section of 2" webbing threaded and cut to size where I can mount as many or as few D rings as I want to-And anywhere I want to OR some super padded stuff - I would imagine that its not as flexible in D ring placement. So what are the advantages/disadvantage-The padded stuff looks more comfortable but is it defeating a point of the BP/W? Some look so padded that its hard to tell them from more a traditional BC.

The single piece "Hogarthian" style harness does allow for extra drings etc.

I would however caution against adding a bunch of extra "stuff". There's a reason why divers doing **Big** dives aren't festooned with extra bits.

Resist the temptation to start with a nice clean, simple streamlined BP&W, and customize it back into an "over featured" super duper "tech" ready BC.

Tobin

 

[cool_hardware52]

So considering the above if you are looking for only 1 plate... I'd have to consider your warmest water configurations. you can always add weight to pockets and/or a weight belt for trim and buoyancy and most dive ops you'll visit while traveling will supply weight.
For wing choice I agree that the coldest water configuration is the controlling factor. While these two considerations are opposite sides of the spectrum there are some wings that will work. This will leave the diver with a rig that is less than optimal in most cases but also completely safe and reliable for the greatest range of conditions.

RA,


Maybe after you have designed, built and sold a few thousand BP&W to divers all over the world I'll start to consider your opinion.

Until then it's anecdotal back round noise based on a single data point.

Tobin

 

[mdb]

"Opinions are like gas;
You're entitled to have some, but people appreciate if you keep it to yourself when it stinks!"

I'm sure you will have some replies from the "experts".

 

[OldNSalty]

The single piece "Hogarthian" style harness does allow for extra drings etc.

I would however caution against adding a bunch of extra "stuff". There's a reason why divers doing **Big** dives aren't festooned with extra bits.

Resist the temptation to start with a nice clean, simple streamlined BP&W, and customize it back into an "over featured" super duper "tech" ready BC.

Tobin

I hear ya Tobin but I don't think I own any super duper tech stuff...maybe I do and don't know it. Right now, I could probably get by with 1 D ring-where can I load up on some of this duper tech?

 

[scuba127]

This seems like a good thread on which to post my opinion on the Deep Sea Supply single tank rig. I test drove this rig in my pool today (FYI: We have a big pool - 10' deep in the deep end and 50,000 gallons total). Prior to today I had done only 4 dives with BP/W. These 4 dives were on a Dive Rite steel Transplate and adjustable harness I borrowed from my TDI Advanced Nitrox Instructor. Those 4 dives were enough to convince me that BP/W is the way to go after diving recreational BCs for 15 After much research I decided on DSS for a singles rig. The first thing I would like to address is the HOG Harness. I originally wanted to go with an adjustable harness like the one on the Transplate. I was all paranoid about being able to get in on/off etc. since I do alot of solo diving. Needless to say I was absolutely shocked to find the Hog Harness was actually easier to get on and off by myself than my Oceanic BC. My wife was sitting there watching me donning the rig (she also has an Oceanic BC) and when she saw how easy it was to don the HOG she commented that it appeared the fact that the harness straps did not twist and there was not alot of material on the harness to snag stuff on that it actually look easier to get on than our Oceanics. I was totally stoked to learn this cause I really wanted to make the Hog Harness work. In the water you can't even tell its there. My advice: stick with the HOG Harness and blow off the adjustable comfort harnesses. The only thing I have added to the HOG is a d-ring on the bottom right side. The second concern I had was the fact that that a tank stablilizer is not used with this rig. Once again, I was worrying about nothing. The tank stuck to the plate like glue. It felt like when solid unit and did not wobble in the slightest. I was once again stoked about not having to worry about keeping track of a STA, mounting the STA, etc. Third, the method in which the wing mounts to the plate using rubber grommets. Again, much ado about nothing. The wing pops right on the plate and stays there. You don't have to fool around with bolts, wing nuts or whatever when mounting the wing. The rig consisted of a steel plate, HOG harness, regulator and 20lb. wing with Aluminum 80. The 20lb. wing floated the rig on the surface no problem and the steel plate sunk the rig without having to add weight. This was pool water and the rig sank easily. I'm speculating thats its gonna be just about perfect in salt water. I was wearing a 3mm wetsuit. Based on my expirience today, I recommend going with the steel plate in salt water, aluminum 80 and 3mm wetsuit. In conclusion, I strongly recommend this bad boy. I'm taking TDI Decompression Procedures in Oct. I'll definately by ordering up a DSS doubles rig when the class is successfully accomplished. In conclusion: DSS Single rig highly recommended! Just my 2PSI.