Barge crash in St Lawrence

[Mr Adams]

You all have good arguemental points, Calcium Chloride is converted into a dry material for industry by removing its moisture, but When calcium chloride is converted into a liquid hence thrown down on ice, it gives off heat. Calcium chloride will melt ice at temperatures of-25° F. This stuff is also used in the production of cement and stone products, so either way dilution in fresh water is damaging to "surrounding" plant and crustacean life.

Mr A

 

[Warren_L]

You all have good arguemental points, Calcium Chloride is converted into a dry material for industry by removing its moisture, but When calcium chloride is converted into a liquid hence thrown down on ice, it gives off heat. Calcium chloride will melt ice at temperatures of-25° F. This stuff is also used in the production of cement and stone products, so either way dilution in fresh water is damaging to plant and crustacean life.

Mr A

All true. But my point about dilution .... a grain of salt in a glass of water probably isn't going to have much of an effect.

 

[scubascudadoo]

Seriously? Didn't someone somewhere say something about blanket statements. d33ps1x, where are you??

Seeing as I don't see anything in your posts that would suggest you understand what CaCl's effect on biological systems is, I can tell you that if you ingested a gram of CaCl and a gram of cyanide (which is what I presume you mean by cyninde) that the effects of the latter would be far more devastating.

Let see. Do you know if LD50 rating for cyninde is higher then for CaCl?

I will give you that when chemicals are diluted in water they reduce the possible damage done. But you were palinly saying that the spill would causeno damage.

That is incorrect and false. That is what upset me. We only have one world to live in. If we destory it we're screwed.

 

[scubascudadoo]

You all have good arguemental points, Calcium Chloride is converted into a dry material for industry by removing its moisture, but When calcium chloride is converted into a liquid hence thrown down on ice, it gives off heat. Calcium chloride will melt ice at temperatures of-25° F. This stuff is also used in the production of cement and stone products, so either way dilution in fresh water is damaging to plant and crustacean life.

Mr A

Just to clarify. Mr.Adams

Actual it like salt used on roads actual absorbs moisture rather then creating heat. The burns are a resolute of a chemical burn rather then heat.

 

[scubascudadoo]

I think that this stream has gone the distance. To all I do apology if I came across harsh. Damage has been done to are enviroment, the amount of damage is yet to be seen.

 

[Mr Adams]

Yes! true but when you throw calcium chloride onto ice it reacts with moisture and creates chemical reaction which in turn melts ice that eventualy ends up in sewers and in your water ways.

Cheer

 

[Mr Adams]

No trouble here scubascudadoo

I thought it was just those two who were argueing and about what I have no idea, i'm just an old idiot I don't no anything.

Mr A

 

[scubascudadoo]

Yes! true but when you throw calcium chloride onto ice it reacts with moisture and creates heat which in turn melts the ice which end up in sewers and our water ways.

Cheer

I guess from your point of view I see that. I hold a Land Class 1 and 2 pesticide license and have in the past worked in the landscaping industry. It is primaryily used CaCl for walkways due to the fact that it like you said it will work at -25 where salt stops at about -10 or so. It also leaves an invisiable residue that will keep working in latter snow falls. The heat as you said really is a chemical reaction to snow(water). There is no actual heat created but a cheical change to the mixing of cheical CaCl and H2O.

But for all intents and purposes yes you are correct. It does seem to generate indirect heat.

 

[scubascudadoo]

No trouble here scubascudadoo

I thought it was just those two who were argueing and about what I have no idea, i'm just an old idiot I don't no anything.

Mr A

LOL...

Goodnight to all and to all a good night

 

[Boogie711]

No one likes to see an environmental spill in our Scuba Playground. As a diver, it hurts to hear about. But the good news is - our lake will be fine. Let's look at why.

For reference sake, I was the consultant called in to the town of Walkerton during "the crisis" and also helped assist the City of Barrie when they had to reveal the presence of a chemical contamination plume in municipal groundwater. So, with that in mind, I think it helps if we put this in perspective.

OK - according to the International Joint Commission, the Great Lakes holds approximately 6 Quadrillion Litres of water. Using somewhat conservative math, this means that Lake Ontario holds approximately 300,000,000,000,000 litres, or approximately 3 hundred trillion litres.

If you need another source, according to the Great Lakes Information Network, Lake Ontario alone holds 2,337,585,000,000 litres (2.3 hundred trillion.) Close enough.

If you assume the affected portion of Lake Ontario and the St. Lawrence is only one half of one percent, this still means we're talking about 11,687,925,000(Eleven billion, six hundred eighty eight million.)

12 thousand gallons of calcium chloride leaked out. That's (assuming we're talking metric, not even imperial gallons) only 60 thousand litres.

Quite simply, for every drop of calcium chloride, we have 1,000 litres of water. Or, in simple terms, if you spilled one cup of CaCL, we have approximately 3 Olympic sized swimming pools worth of water.

Secondly, according to Material Safety Data Sheets, CaCL is non reactive to human skin. First aid response involves flushing with water. It is heavier than water (with a specific gravity of 2.152) and is soluble to the effect of 74.5 g/100 cc water. It will generate some heat upon contact with water, however, given the warm water nature of the St. Lawrence seaway, I wouldn't anticipate short term heat variations to have a significant effect on marine biology. It is also non-acidic or basic, with a pH of between 6.4 and 7.1.

In short - the good news is that our lake will be fine. Any affects will be local, short-lived and easily recoverable. If anyone would like to question how I arrived at the numbers, or where I looked up the data points, I'd be happy to discuss via PM.