Tipping

[Lorenzoid]

Why it is not inclued inside the dive price directly ?

Because that's not the custom. I am sure I am not the only American who very much wished it were included. Tipping is awkward. But it's too entrenched in our economy--it's even acknowledged in the tax laws--to be changed at this point. There are some types of businesses, such as a few restaurants, that have tried to adopt a "no tipping" policy and simply increase their posted prices, but it is not easy to change entrenched customs. As far as I know, no dive operator has attempted this.

 

[2airishuman]

Why it is not inclued inside the dive price directly ?

Due to socioeconomic and historical reasons, specific to the USA, and beyond the practical control of any individual diver, crewmember, or operator.

 

[npole]

@npole, I disagree as far as tipping in the US. It's different in Europe, where dive staff's wages fully compensate them for their work. In the US, as you may know, there are types of employees who are not paid fully, and the tacit understanding among employee, employer, and customer is that the customer is expected to pay a part of the employee's compensation--it's referred to as a "tip," but in reality it is simply a normal portion of the person's compensation, and has little to do with the historical purpose of a tip, which was to reward good service. So, the answer to your question of "why should it be different in other countries" is that it IS different in the US.

Employees not paid fully? So the shop owner is counting his money expecting me to pay for what he should have paid? The wrong side then is the shop and its owner, not me. Another reason to not continue with this "not mandatory but expected" tipping nonsense: fix your business, pay your employees, add that percentage to the full price and stop using exotic stupid solutions.

 

[Lorenzoid]

Employees not paid fully? So the shop owner is counting his money expecting me to pay for what he should have paid? The wrong side then is the shop and its owner, not me. Another reason to not continue with this "not mandatory but expected" tipping nonsense: fix your business, pay your employees, add that percentage to the full price and stop using exotic stupid solutions.

I agree with you that it should be that way. If you wish, please try to persuade dive shop owners. (And restaurants, and taxis, and ....)

 

[Olariuas]

Employees not paid fully? So the shop owner is counting his money expecting me to pay for what he should have paid? The wrong side then is the shop and its owner, not me. Another reason to not continue with this "not mandatory but expected" tipping nonsense: fix your business, pay your employees, add that percentage to the full price and stop using exotic stupid solutions.

Cannot agree more. I can found other solutions to say thank you to someone and start maybe a friendship cause for sure I will come back.
Beer - a pack of beer - Solve everything

Now speaking about my country.
DM and Federal instructor (from FFESSM/CMAS diving club path) are not paid. And local dive center / shop of course enjoy to 'hide' them during their beginning career etc.
To be paid you need to do a specific diploma because the laws say that, because you break it you can have sanctions / not sure about jail.

Your PADI DM / Instructor certifications without that specific diploma (add up 9 000$ more) can't allow you to do commercial tasks and of course you are not paid.

Now if you go behind a tree and ninja give him cash inside his pocket without everyone know -- yep this is working.

I currently have no idea if BSAC-UK members inside a diving club are paid for their hard work to organize and manage a diving club but this is exactly the same. You are not paid. But you have 3$ 15 EAN32 tanks and if you manage to shore diving you enjoy a bit more. You still have to pay a boat rental or get service from a affilited local dive shop with cheap discount rate.

 

[npole]

I agree with you that it should be that way. If you wish, please try to persuade dive shop owners. (And restaurants, and taxis, and ....)

I do already: I work expecting a payment that I have agreed for. I do not offer my service if the compensation doesn't match my job. I do not rely on a not predicted and variable income as a "tip".

 

[DiverDownD3]

Not really hard to understand, research the certain cultures before you go there. Try to blend in and do not do things that are seen as offensive. If you don't want to tip in America because you don't in France, be prepared to be seen as a cheapskate.

Think of it this way, I'm sure you've seen Americans in your country that have done things that are seen as offensive because "that's the way Murica does it". People like that are a bad representation, it's embarrassing. Now think of the negative thoughts you've had about these kinds of people. You've probably mentally cussed these people, and rightfully so. This is no different.

It's really not that awkward to tip. Find the mate after the charter, fold a $20 in your hand and pass it off as you shake their hand.

 

[Steelyeyes]

Employees not paid fully? So the shop owner is counting his money expecting me to pay for what he should have paid? The wrong side then is the shop and its owner, not me. Another reason to not continue with this "not mandatory but expected" tipping nonsense: fix your business, pay your employees, add that percentage to the full price and stop using exotic stupid solutions.

Fantastic idea but until that change actually occurs we can't expect the DM and boat crew to work for next to nothing. I don't go to Europe, Mexico, or Indonesia and complain about their culture. That behavior earns the "Ugly American" nickname. I think similar sensitivity to our culture from people from other nations would be fair. I could be wrong.

Oh, and to add further complexity to the issue, we don't tip the business owner, even if he's on the boat, his money comes from the profit on the whole operation. I tip the lead crew member or put the tip in the jar for that purpose.

 

[DanielRJones]

Boat dive in the uk £20 so about £30 i bring my own gear my own tank and dive and have a mug of soup on the way back and no tip is expected.

Wh i was in america i way paying twice the peice and then was expected to tip on top. What am i tipping for i recieved less service than in the uk where i had a cup of soup to warm me up. I carried my own gear i brought my own gear i paid to rent a tank and paid for my air fills and i paid for the dive.
What service has the operation provided me to deserve a tip and no talking to me nice is not a reason for a tip.
Turning on my air? Please dont touch my gear i am not doing my ow first dives i am qualified and my gear is life saving equiptment I Dont expect it to be touched without permission.

Striking up conversations? No thanks i dive to spend time with my wife or friends not make meaningless chit chat with someone.

Giving a breifing? I have paid for a dive this should be included.

Offering to carry my gear? I was told if you cant carry your own gear you cant dive and this was enforced from 12 year old kids through to retired adults. I am more than capable of carrying my own gear when someone else touches my gear it means doing prechecks again.

 

[Olariuas]

I do understand honestly and I am really open-minded and I love to interact with people. I won't hesitate already to give money or food to homeless etc...

Now it will depend. And its a pity that I might be seen as a cheapskate and if I wonder if I should care or not. I will still sleep very-well at night cause after all everyone done a good job and I paid to get into the boat and dive safe.

Now if I notice that I forgot to tip the day before and that today the service is bad or crews reply me like ******** noway byebye.