Are you a Dive Hypocrite?

[Sas]

Go back and read it more carefully. That's not the conclusion. It's saying even if you eat less, you probably won't loose much weight if that's all you do.

No it shows that rhesus monkeys have this issue. And it says that reducing calorie intake reduces physical activity, which again, is something that you can control if you want.

Weight loss is mostly about what you eat with exercise helping, for sure. But you don't need to eat much to undo the benefits of any exercise you have done.

 

[Sas]

I agree with what you're saying that people need to take control of their lives. I don't agree with your premise that it's as simple as you make it out to be.

I said it was simple, but not that it was easy. It is just about walking away from the cheeseburgers, but you have to have the willpower to do this.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I said it was simple, but not that it was easy. It is just about walking away from the cheeseburgers, but you have to have the willpower to do this.

Sorry Sas ... I love ya, but I gotta call BS on that one.

Got about 50 years of practice to say you're wrong. There's a lot more to it than simply willpower.

You need further education on this topic ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Sas]

Sorry Sas ... I love ya, but I gotta call BS on that one.

Got about 50 years of practice to say you're wrong. There's a lot more to it than simply willpower.

You need further education on this topic ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

And I have a lot of experience with weight loss

Nearly all obese people are obese because they eat too much and don't exercise. It really is that simple. The reasons why they eat too much and don't exercise enough may be complicated however. The first treatment for obesity is changing diet and encouraging exercise. Most people won't (not can't but won't, for various reasons) so then it tends to move on to medication and surgery.

We can agree to disagree. But I personally hate the cop out of genetics. I am most likely genetically predisposed to anorexia given latest research of the link between autism and anorexia but I don't blame that for things within my control such as what I put in my mouth...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

We can agree to disagree. But I personally hate the cop out of genetics. I am most likely genetically predisposed to anorexia given latest research of the link between autism and anorexia but I don't blame that for things within my control such as what I put in my mouth...

Who said anything about genetics? Even I think that's an overused excuse.

I'm talking about adaptation. The human body's incredibly adaptable ... and once it becomes adapted to being overweight, it's much more difficult to take it off and maintain it off than you might be inclined to believe. Sure you can do it ... but it gets more difficult with time.

Someone who's been overweight their entire lives will work much, MUCH harder to lose the same five pounds than someone who has just gotten sloppy and gained some extra weight over a shorter period of time.

Likewise, it's much more difficult for older people to lose weight than younger people.

Bodies adapt ... just like every other living organism on the planet.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Sas]

Who said anything about genetics? Even I think that's an overused excuse.

I'm talking about adaptation. The human body's incredibly adaptable ... and once it becomes adapted to being overweight, it's much more difficult to take it off and maintain it off than you might be inclined to believe. Sure you can do it ... but it gets more difficult with time.

Someone who's been overweight their entire lives will work much, MUCH harder to lose the same five pounds than someone who has just gotten sloppy and gained some extra weight over a shorter period of time.

Likewise, it's much more difficult for older people to lose weight than younger people.

Bodies adapt ... just like every other living organism on the planet.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Well part of the discussion here is about how genetics can influence obesity and I originally responded to someone who was indicating that this made obesity not entirely someone's fault.

Sure I agree that it is harder to lose weight for various people. But then everyone has different things they find harder to other people, doesn't mean that they should use this difficulty as an excuse for no action.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Well part of the discussion here is about how genetics can influence obesity and I originally responded to someone who was indicating that this made obesity not entirely someone's fault.

Sure I agree that it is harder to lose weight for various people. But then everyone has different things they find harder to other people, doesn't mean that they should use this difficulty as an excuse for no action.

There's a difference between no action and ineffective action. When someone tries and fails, action can often become counterproductive. People who constantly go on "diets" set themselves up for failure ... because the whole notion of a "diet" implies that you will reach a goal and there's an endpoint. It doesn't work that way. People who do that may lose weight ... but then they'll just fall back into their routine and put it right back on again. After a few cycles of that, taking the weight off becomes increasingly more difficult.

That's not to say it can't be done ... just that it gets harder with practice.

I know where you're coming from ... but it's not as trivial a matter as you make it out to be. Takes a lot more work than that ... and for the perpetually overweight, it's work that won't "end" until the day you die.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Sas]

There's a difference between no action and ineffective action. When someone tries and fails, action can often become counterproductive. People who constantly go on "diets" set themselves up for failure ... because the whole notion of a "diet" implies that you will reach a goal and there's an endpoint. It doesn't work that way. People who do that may lose weight ... but then they'll just fall back into their routine and put it right back on again. After a few cycles of that, taking the weight off becomes increasingly more difficult.

That's not to say it can't be done ... just that it gets harder with practice.

I know where you're coming from ... but it's not as trivial a matter as you make it out to be. Takes a lot more work than that ... and for the perpetually overweight, it's work that won't "end" until the day you die.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I don't think it is a trivial matter at all. It is simple to lose weight which I think you keep interpreting as 'easy'. What you need to do is simple but it is really hard to do these simple things.

I agree with most of what you say actually. The biggest issue with those who seek to lose weight is that they go on a fad 'diet' to do so which of course works in the short term if you stick to it but who can eat celery all day every day for the rest of their lives? (or substitute celery with whatever crazy thing is in fashion now). People have to realise that you need change entire your lifestyle to lose weight and become healthy - and you need to eat things you can eat for the rest of your life. Most people want short term solutions to losing weight and give up easily. All of this does not mean it is not their responsibility when they fail. I have tried a lot of things and failed at a lot of things but the failure is my fault, not 'society's' or 'my genes' or 'because it is too hard'. Usually it is because I have been ignorant about what I am trying to achieve, lazy or weak.

Or maybe I have watched Gattaca too many times...

 

[Superlyte27]

Trimix for a 200+ foot dive costs more than for a 100 foot dive (more Helium), so I doubt you'll be able to afford it even if you get that inkling.



Try reading what I actually typed. I CAN'T afford trimix for a 100' dive. I'm doing 10-15 100'ish dives per month. I pay $70/ K-Bottle of Helium (I think that's 225 or 250cu' of helium). You do the math.

I haven't dove over 200' this year. So lets say I do 4 200+ Dives per year at my current helium prices, that's a WHOLE lot more affordable than 120 Dives at 100' on Helium.

So, to reiterate... I cannot afford to pay for Trimix for a 100' dive. I'm doing 4 dives this week at 100+ feet. Can you imagine what that would cost me in helium? I'm sorry but that's way out of my budget and quite honestly according to my education, unnecessary.

 

[vladimir]

Wish I could find the 'fat tax' article I read yesterday.

Was it the one from Slate? Look at post #33 in this thread.

Ah, here's a link to that article. Finally found it.

I'm glad you found it. It's a good article and a great contribution to the thread.