Do I Need AOW to Travel?

[MXGratefulDiver]

The AOW requirement by a lot of shops is a fairly recent trend. I think the primary reasons are liability concerns and an increasing number of OW-certified divers with little to no actual diving skill. But I also think that agencies push these policies as a way to increase cert sales.

When I was OW certified by the YMCA in 2001 the depth limit was 130 feet. The 60-foot limit was a recommendation for newly-certified divers. Suddenly, in the eyes of many operators, an AOW certified diver with 9 dives is somehow more qualified for depth than an OW diver with years of experience and hundreds of dives.

Go figure ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[DevonDiver]

If I refer to "limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING" an open water diver is not trained to go deeper than 18m.......
But, again, if I ear the standards correctly, "limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING" ... what is the result of a training if not a certification?

I'd challenge any assertion that the AOW Deep Adventure Dive provided any TRAINING for deep diving, or even any TRAINING that specifically increased a diver's capability to dive below 18m.

It's an experiential dive, with little/no training given - and it doesn't introduce any new skills, beyond those already taught on the OW course:

Performance Requirements
1. Descend using a line, wall or sloping bottom. Descent with/without visual reference taught on OW
2. Compare changes in color at the surface and at depth. Not a deep diving 'skill' - theory of color saturation taught on OW
3. Compare a depth gauge to another diver’s depth gauge. SPG monitoring taught on OW
4. Ascend at a rate not to exceed 18 metres/60 feet per minute using a dive computer (or depth gauge and timing device). Ascent taught on OW
5. Make a safety stop at 5 metres/15 feet for at least three minutes. Safety Stop taught on OW

Add to this the fact that the minimum depth for AOW Deep Dive is 18m... and there cannot even be any certainty that the AOW qualified diver even has experience of diving below OW qualified depths.

...what is the result of a training if not a certification?

In this instance, perhaps it is more pertinent to ask "what is the result of certification, without training?"

Training:
The action of teaching a person or animal a particular skill or type of behavior.

Wikipedia: Training is the acquisition of knowledge, skills, and competencies as a result of the teaching of vocational or practical skills and knowledge that relate to specific useful competencies. Training has specific goals of improving one's capability, capacity, and performance.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

But, again, if I ear the standards correctly, "limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING" ... what is the result of a training if not a certification?

Some levels of TRAINING have always come without a certification ... either in the form of mentors or workshops.

11 of the 18 classes I've taught so far this year have come without certification cards ... because they focus on diving skills, not rituals specified by some agency.

Certifications serve a purpose ... they are not the end-all of a diver's fitness to dive. They were never intended to be that. But agencies push that mentality as a means to increase sales.

As with many things in scuba diving, the policy doesn't always serve the interest of the customer ... but it DOES always serve the interest of the agency.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[scubajo007]

On a recent trip to the Philippines we had one of the dive shop managers ask us for our AOW c card. When he found out that we only had OW he seemed concerned and wanted to limit our diving. Fortunately the tour organizer had a word with him and we were able to dive with the rest of the group. I am now wondering if I might run into this again.

1. Are we likely to run across operations that won't let us do certain dives because we don't have AOW, and if so, where?

Yes you will, talking about the Philippines expect you will be asked if the dive is the likes of Donna Marilyn (deep wreck near Malapasqua), and sunken island at Moalboal, otherwise I haven't been asked for AOW certification, and no complains doing dives deeper than 18m for OW divers. One thing you have to be aware of is that if you only are certified OW and you dive deeper than 18m don't expect any insurance will cover.

 

[windapp]

It really doesn't matter what anybody's opinion is on the this board. The fact of the matter is that, for liability reasons, many dive ops require AOW before they will take you on dives beyond 18 m. Many of them are very rigid when it comes to this rule.

I would suggest finding a really good dive operation where you are going, and plan the course as part of your trip. The dives are a lot of fun, and, if you get a good instructor, you can learn a lot. If you choose the right dive operation, you can get excelent value for this course, often times only paying a small sum over what you would have paid for the dives anyway.

 

[denniscloutier]

It really doesn't matter what anybody's opinion is on the this board. The fact of the matter is that, for liability reasons, many dive ops require AOW before they will take you on dives beyond 18 m. Many of them are very rigid when it comes to this rule.

I would suggest finding a really good dive operation where you are going, and plan the course as part of your trip. The dives are a lot of fun, and, if you get a good instructor, you can learn a lot. If you choose the right dive operation, you can get excelent value for this course, often times only paying a small sum over what you would have paid for the dives anyway.

Which ops, where? The fact is, as I mentioned in my original post, I have dived in quite a few places without running into this. In fact, I have accumulated 250 dives and only been asked once. So, it sounds like the Keys are probably a no-go zone for me without AOW. Does anyone know of any other specific areas where this is probably the case?

Thanks again,

 

[Blackwood]

I've only travel dived a few places (Mexico, Hawaii, Tahiti), but I was never asked to show an AOW card (which is fortunate since I don't have one).

 

[dwatts]

I was in Costa Rica in June and we dove with Rich Coast Diving. I have my PADI AOW but my dive buddy only has his NAUI OW. However, he has more dives than me. Once we were on the boat the DM asked each person what their cert was. My buddy told him and the DM insisted tha tmy buddy stay above 60 feet.

NOTE: The site we were diving was about 80 feet to the sand.

My buddy argued for a minute but the DM insisted.

SIDE NOTE: For various reasons we would never dive with Rich Coast again!

 

[DivemasterDennis]

The fact is, each dive op can and does set its own rules. The earlier post on calling or emailing for information is excellent advice. No one person speaks for every operator. I recommend that after 20 or so "real dives" everyone consider the AOW class. It can be very useful, and it does give the diver a credential that many operators will require for some of their dives. Some of those operators will accept a log book showing dives in similar conditions to similar depths, but not all. Other alternatives include paying for a private DM, which some will offer, and another is traveling with a current and insured DM and dive with that person. Debbie does this with me, and takes her log book showing she has an open water cert, and hundreds of dives, a very large portion over 100 feet. There is no down side to getting an AOW certification, and you might (and should) learn a bit about being a better diver.
DivemasterDennis

 

[drbill]

When I first started traveling internationally, "all" I had was my Los Angeles County OW c-card. Of course that training back in the 60s allowed us to do anything today's AOW diver can, plus included rescue techniques. I repeatedly met PADI instructors who had no clue what the LAC c-card was good for (including instructors working overseas but who came from Los Angeles). It wasn't until I hit Cairns to do the Great Barrier Reef that the instructor there not only recognized my LAC c-card, but said it was a museum piece. I explained the problem I was having and he offered to get me a PADI AOW card for the cost of the materials. Once I had that, I had something to use with other instructors who were clueless about the history of our activity and its certification.